BREAKING NEWS: AdViewGlobal Cited As Extension Of AdSurfDaily In RICO Complaint Against Andy Bowdoin

UPDATED 1:26 P.M. EDT (U.S.A.) AdViewGlobal has been cited in a racketeering lawsuit against AdSurfDaily President Andy Bowdoin as an extension of ASD.

In a motion filed this morning, the plaintiffs pointed out that a bank had closed a Bowdoin account while he was running ASD, after suspicious banking activity triggered Ponzi concerns. The plaintiffs then said suspicious banking acvivity also occurred with AdViewGlobal.

“Likewise, a bank recently suspended or closed the accounts of Adview Global due to excessive wire transactions exceeding $9500,” the plaintiffs said.

“AVG is the next iteration of the Ponzi scheme auto-surf programs, which [are] staffed with former ASD executives and Bowdoin disciples, including George Harris, the stepson of Bowdoin, who is listed as an AVG trustee, Gary Talbert, former ASD executive served as CEO of AVG and now serves as an accountant, Nate Boyd, a former compliance officer at ASD, serves as “Protector” of the AVG association, and Chuck Osmin, a former ASD employee who testified on ASD’s behalf at the evidentiary hearing before this Court last fall is a customer service representative of AVG.”

It was not immediately clear if the plaintiffs in the RICO case — all of whom are members of ASD — intended to file an amended complaint that would specifically name AVG a RICO defendant.

The original RICO lawsuit was filed in January against Bowdoin, ASD attorney Robert Garner and Golden Panda Ad Builder President Clarence Busby. The lawsuit was amended in April. Bowdoin has not responded to the complaint. The plaintiffs dismissed Busby as a defendant earlier this month.

Among other things, the motion filed by the plaintiffs this morning also claims millions of dollars under Bowdoin’s control held offshore have never been repatriated. The motion includes a link to the PatrickPretty.com Blog, noting its reporting on ties between ASD and AVG.

At the same time, today’s motion by the plaintiffs asks U.S. District Judge Rosemary Collyer to deny a motion to stay the lawsuit until the government’s lawsuits against assets tied to ASD are litigated.

Bank of America was accused in the lawsuit of aiding and abetting Bowdoin and ASD. The bank is not named a RICO defendant and says it has done nothing wrong.

The plaintiffs disagree.

“For well over two years Bank of America embraced and never said no to the RICO Defendants who operated this nationwide scheme from a former floral shop in tiny Quincy, Florida,” the plaintiffs said. “ASD’s legitimacy and business model were never questioned despite being borne out of the demise of “12Daily Pro and Phoenix Surf” which were nothing more than naked Ponzi schemes investigated and eventually prosecuted by the Securities and Exchange Commission in 2006.”

Among other things, Bank of America argued that the plaintiffs already have a compensation remedy because the government has seized approximately $80 million in the ASD case.

Attorneys for the plaintiffs, however, argued that the remedy is insufficient because ASD victims cannot be fully compensated if the government establishes a restitution program and that the plaintiffs are seeking treble damages under U.S. law.

“Without Bank of America, [ASD] could have only existed in the dark alleys of the financial world where they would need to rely on off-shore accounts and questionable deposit facilities. There this scheme would have been far less likely to [metastasize] and wreak the havoc it did on so many people. Thus the stay requested by Defendant should be rejected.”

Read the plaintiff’s motion.

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111 Responses to “BREAKING NEWS: AdViewGlobal Cited As Extension Of AdSurfDaily In RICO Complaint Against Andy Bowdoin”

  1. It’s interesting……….from the langauge in the motion it leads me to believe that the plaintiffs are Patrick Pretty readers!

    This “new revolutionary company” will be sunk soon.

    Patrick, have you been able to find anything out about the no payout window being extended from 30 to 40 days?

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  2. Is there a link to the actual document announcing this news Patrick?

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  3. Hi alasycia,

    alasycia: Is there a link to the actual document announcing this news Patrick?

    It’s at the bottom of the story above.

    Patrick

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  4. Thanks Patrick – I swear it wasnt there before! lol

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  5. Patrick, once again, you have your finger on the pulse of current events, and are beginning to sway even the most ardent ASD/AVG supporters back into reality. You are hereby commended and given one “Atta Boy!”

    Don

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  6. Don: Patrick, once again, you have your finger on the pulse of current events, and are beginning to sway even the most ardent ASD/AVG supporters back into reality. You are hereby commended and given one “Atta Boy!”Don

    That’s what happens when you shine a light on these scams and why the promoters try to invoke copyright and every other ruse in the known universe to keep the investors/ad buyers/victims from getting information from other sources other than the promoters. Good job Patrick!

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  7. If I knew how, I would add one of Don’s clapping and cheering little fella’s.

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  8. Yes, you will have to change the title from Breaking News to Making News.

    Like this, Cathy? Don’t know if Patrick’s blog allows this. But here goes.

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  9. Nope – pics not allowed – well here’s the link and a well deserved round of applause

    http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p158/cdchase/applaud.gif>7a>

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  10. Quick note:

    The motion filed this morning may be important for a couple of reasons: First, it names AVG in a public filing. Second, it is consistent with what the plaintiffs have argued all along: That ASD operated as a racketeering enterprise with unnamed co-conspirators.

    One way to look at the RICO lawsuit is that the plaintiffs announced their intentions in January to investigate potential tentacles of ASD. AVG’s ties to ASD are obvious.

    It was obvious in January that any money directed at AVG could become the subject of a two-prong attack: by the government AND private litigants.

    Despite this, AVG followed through with the launch, thus putting every dollar paid by members in the position of becoming part of public AND private litigation — private litigation being defined as lawsuits filed by individuals, as opposed to government entities.

    Patrick

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  11. Hot off the other forum…

    Allegations pointed at AVG??
    By Christopher McKinster
    Hello All,

    I may not be liked for bringing this up but in a form filed with the ASD lawsuit still on going AVG is added to the filing as being linked to ASD and possible wire fraud and money laundering.

    Now I’m not trying to be negative here but if the company knows something about this please let us have all the facts as well! Again I know I this stuff can get blown out of proportion but legal documents do not lie. This was again filed today in Judge Colleyers court room.

    Chris

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  12. Anyone get the idea the wheels are beginning to fall off this bus? We have a mailing address of a UPS store in North Carolina and phone number; a customer service phone number that is an unlisted cell phone number in Homesetead, FL (786-752-4143); the company is registered in Uruguay; and the company bank account is half-way around the world.

    This is the company that is going to be the “LEADER” of Internet advertising, and an International company. Well, they got the International part right.

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  13. With Andy Bowdoin’s right hand man (or woman) Judy HJarris, purportedly being the owner of AVGA, along with her husband,Faye Bowdoin Harris’s son, George Harris, it is difficult to see how anyone can miss the link between ASD and AVGA. lol Quite apart from the fact that the officers and principal promoters in the company are also ex-ASD. Where the “new girl” Donna Rougeau was a member of ASD is unknown, but she certainly seems to have asome background as a playa (sorry Professional Internet Marketer)

    The saddest part is that Patrick and many others have been trying to tell these people that they run a great risk in involving themselves in any ASD successor, and it is only now it has appeared in a document filed with the court that they realise it might well be true.

    Did the owners, founders and promoters of AVGA seriously believe that they would escape the radar? Or did they care?

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  14. Cathy G.: Hot off the other forum…Allegations pointed at AVG??By Christopher McKinsterHello All,I may not be liked for bringing this up but in a form filed with the ASD lawsuit still on going AVG is added to the filing as being linked to ASD and possible wire fraud and money laundering.Now I’m not trying to be negative here but if the company knows something about this please let us have all the facts as well! Again I know I this stuff can get blown out of proportion but legal documents do not lie. This was again filed today in Judge Colleyers court room.Chris

    Careful Cathy. Copyright violations you know.

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  15. And it is now gone forever on the other forum.

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  16. alasycia,

    They don’t care. Plain and simple.

    Remeber David Courtney?!? His AVG videos about how “this thing is secret get in now” blah blah blah. How about Mark Simmons’ recent promotion of AVG using the Forbes name? Neither of them are saying a peep about AVG now. They got their money in, probably out, and now there is a flock left over who will get nothing.

    I’m not sure if Correction! and those others that come here are people who have profited and are trying to state their case for their conscience, or if they are just angry people who know that their money is lost in AVG. Either way it’s quite pathetic.

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  17. Quick note:

    A thread about AVG’s name appearing in the RICO case filings was posted at Surf’s Up today. The thread has been deleted.

    Patrick

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  18. Well of course it has. Does a robber put on a mask before he robs a bank? Conceal the evidence…..

    admin: Quick note:A thread about AVG’s name appearing in the RICO case filings was posted at Surf’s Up today. The thread has been deleted.Patrick

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  19. Sicilian: It’s interesting……….from the langauge in the motion it leads me to believe that the plaintiffs are Patrick Pretty readers!This “new revolutionary company” will be sunk soon.Patrick,have you been able to find anything out about the no payout window being extended from 30 to 40 days?

    It sounds to me like a couple of individuals. I read and reread it and I’m still trying to figure out what the charges are. Pretty vague and you are right it sounds exactly like a couple of Patrick’s cyberrag readers. You make that look like big news, it’s nothing.

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  20. Joe,

    joe: You make that look like big news, it’s nothing.

    Actually, it’s something.

    AVG’s name now appears in a public filing in a RICO case. That’s information any potential prospect of AVG needs to know, because any money they put in AVG could make them a part of litigation.

    Patrick

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  21. joe:

    Sicilian: It’s interesting……….from the langauge in the motion it leads me to believe that the plaintiffs are Patrick Pretty readers!This “new revolutionary company” will be sunk soon.Patrick,have you been able to find anything out about the no payout window being extended from 30 to 40 days?

    It sounds to me like a couple of individuals. I read and reread it and I’m still trying to figure out what the charges are. Pretty vague and you are right it sounds exactly like a couple of Patrick’s cyberrag readers. You make that look like big news, it’s nothing.

    I am reminded of Monty Python’s Black Knight skit every time one of these “programs” disappears. There is always some fool stating “it’s merely a flesh wound” after each limb is lost. Has ANY of these programs come back bigger and stronger as is ALWAYS promised? Answer: No, none of them have. Zero. Zilch.

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  22. Quick note:

    A thread about AVG’s name appearing in the RICO case filings was posted at Surf’s Up today. The thread has been deleted.

    Patrick
    I can’t beleive the mods suppressed this! I posted that! maybe I need to repost it again.. people have the right to see news….. whether it’s good news or bad news. It’s news!

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  23. Steve,

    Surf’s Up have been deleting a lot of things that ASD members have the right to see. This includes all the updates to the Judges dockets of late that are not favourable to Andy Bowdoin & Co. and the supression of all posts by certain members who do not see the overall picture the same way they do and who are interested in the truth of the situation, not the PR.

    Surf’s Up has been nothing more than a pro Andy Bowdoin, pro ASD (but not pro members) and pro AVG propaganda site for some time. As it is also the “official forum” for ASD members, that gives you an idea of the disregard they show to most of their members.

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  24. dirty_bird:

    joe:

    Sicilian: It’s interesting……….from the langauge in the motion it leads me to believe that the plaintiffs are Patrick Pretty readers!This “new revolutionary company” will be sunk soon.Patrick,have you been able to find anything out about the no payout window being extended from 30 to 40 days?

    It sounds to me like a couple of individuals. I read and reread it and I’m still trying to figure out what the charges are. Pretty vague and you are right it sounds exactly like a couple of Patrick’s cyberrag readers. You make that look like big news, it’s nothing.

    I am reminded of Monty Python’s Black Knight skit every time one of these “programs” disappears.There is always some fool stating “it’s merely a flesh wound” after each limb is lost.Has ANY of these programs come back bigger and stronger as is ALWAYS promised?Answer:No, none of them have.Zero. Zilch.

    GIVE ME A BREAK, I read the whole thing and it has nothing to do with AVGA it was a tiny little side comment and then you post it as breaking news. How chicken shit! You use the word cited almost as if they are now part of it which they are not. You really are stooping just to fill up the CYBERRAG.

    dirty_bird:

    joe:

    Sicilian: It’s interesting……….from the langauge in the motion it leads me to believe that the plaintiffs are Patrick Pretty readers!This “new revolutionary company” will be sunk soon.Patrick,have you been able to find anything out about the no payout window being extended from 30 to 40 days?

    It sounds to me like a couple of individuals. I read and reread it and I’m still trying to figure out what the charges are. Pretty vague and you are right it sounds exactly like a couple of Patrick’s cyberrag readers. You make that look like big news, it’s nothing.

    I am reminded of Monty Python’s Black Knight skit every time one of these “programs” disappears.There is always some fool stating “it’s merely a flesh wound” after each limb is lost.Has ANY of these programs come back bigger and stronger as is ALWAYS promised?Answer:No, none of them have.Zero. Zilch.

    dirty_bird:

    joe:

    Sicilian: It’s interesting……….from the langauge in the motion it leads me to believe that the plaintiffs are Patrick Pretty readers!This “new revolutionary company” will be sunk soon.Patrick,have you been able to find anything out about the no payout window being extended from 30 to 40 days?

    It sounds to me like a couple of individuals. I read and reread it and I’m still trying to figure out what the charges are. Pretty vague and you are right it sounds exactly like a couple of Patrick’s cyberrag readers. You make that look like big news, it’s nothing.

    I am reminded of Monty Python’s Black Knight skit every time one of these “programs” disappears.There is always some fool stating “it’s merely a flesh wound” after each limb is lost.Has ANY of these programs come back bigger and stronger as is ALWAYS promised?Answer:No, none of them have.Zero. Zilch.

    It’s not even a flesh wound it’s a girly slap at something that isn’t even there. Is that Patrick or Patricia?

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  25. Very nice Joe, stoop to a new low.

    You can insult Patrick all you want. His bank account isn’t in the red because he invested in a scam, nor he is the potential target of a Federal investigation. You on the other hand………

    And yes, being named in a RICO case is really no big deal. Happened to me twice last week. Then I was sentenced to death by lethal injection. No biggie.

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  26. Re-reading Joe’s insulting comments it’s actually very amusing the human psych about how angry and defensive people get when deep down they know that they’ve been duped and their money is gone.

    It’s gone Joe. Maybe Andy will take you out on the Jet Skis for the fourth….oh wait, the Feds seized those too :)

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  27. Joe,

    joe: It’s not even a flesh wound it’s a girly slap at something that isn’t even there. Is that Patrick or Patricia?

    So, you’ve gone from the “F” word to “ass kissers” and now are descending into a girly-man argument.

    AVG has suspended payouts, made a 80/20 program mandatory and now is mentioned in a RICO filing (along with the names of common ASD/AVG staff), and you dismiss it as “nothing.”

    It’s something, Joe — and AVG members at large are beginning to understand.

    Patrick

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  28. Joe,

    I dont know why you guys at AVGA are so bothered by what Patrick Pretty says. After all, he is only an investigative journalist (off and on line). I am even more suprised that you should worry what the public who post here say either. AND I am really shocked that anyone should even turn a hair if AVGA members posts are reproduced outside the AVGA site forum.

    You have spent weeks and months telling us that AVGA is the great legal future of advertising (albeit without any supporting data), so what possible harm can anything printed here do? If all legitimate businesses banned lively and critical observations, microsoft would have closed their own forum years ago and gone bust as well. But they didn’t and haven’t. Thereagain, maybe they consider themselves sufficiently legitimate and therefore safe from financial ruin that they dont have to go into a panic everytime someone says boo

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  29. Hey Joe. It’s the resident idiot here. Were you able to find those gmail and yahoo E-mail accounts used by AVGA? I didn’t want an idiot like me upstaging you with information I had that you didn’t.

    While you are it, you might want to ask Donna why they have a North Carolina UPS store address for mailing, a Florida unlisted cell phone for their customer service line, when the corporate headquarters are in Uruguay and your bank is half-way around the world? I for one would love to hear her answer.

    But then I am sure this is no big deal just like the RICO filing, besides what do I know? I am just the resident idiot here, right Joe?

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  30. Sicilian: Very nice Joe, stoop to a new low.You can insult Patrick all you want.His bank account isn’t in the red because he invested in a scam, nor he is the potential target of a Federal investigation.You on the other hand………And yes, being named in a RICO case is really no big deal.Happened to me twice last week.Then I was sentenced to death by lethal injection.No biggie.

    They were referenced thats it.

    admin: Joe,

    joe: It’s not even a flesh wound it’s a girly slap at something that isn’t even there. Is that Patrick or Patricia?

    So, you’ve gone from the “F” word to “ass kissers” and now are descending into a girly-man argument.AVG has suspended payouts, made a 80/20 program mandatory and now is mentioned in a RICO filing (along with the names of common ASD/AVG staff), and you dismiss it as “nothing.”It’s something, Joe — and AVG members at large are beginning to understand.Patrick

    admin: Joe,

    joe: It’s not even a flesh wound it’s a girly slap at something that isn’t even there. Is that Patrick or Patricia?

    So, you’ve gone from the “F” word to “ass kissers” and now are descending into a girly-man argument.AVG has suspended payouts, made a 80/20 program mandatory and now is mentioned in a RICO filing (along with the names of common ASD/AVG staff), and you dismiss it as “nothing.”It’s something, Joe — and AVG members at large are beginning to understand.Patrick

    I don’t really think theres an argument. They are not part of the lawsuit, they are not plaintiffs, that whole motion was against BofA. AVGA was refernced thats it.

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  31. Hey…anyone heard from Cathy C?

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  32. Opps…Cathy G

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  33. joe…were you on the call? Thata girl Donna!

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  34. Joe,

    joe: I don’t really think theres an argument. They are not part of the lawsuit, they are not plaintiffs, that whole motion was against BofA. AVGA was refernced thats it.

    And you don’t find the references to AVG in a RICO lawsuit disturbing — not even to a point that would cause you to pause and consider potential downstream consequences?

    The issue is not whether AVG is a plaintiff; it’s whether AVG or any of its people will end up as defendants in this or any case that could flow from it.

    AVG has just been used to illustrate a pattern of alleged racketeering. The plaintiffs used the word “iteration,” which means “a repetition,” and then ticked off the names of employees/staff AVG and ASD have in common. The plaintiffs asked a federal judge to take notice.

    The judge knows that at least one of the ASD/AVG persons mentioned has been in her courtroom in a Ponzi scheme, wire-fraud and money-laundering case. And she knows that one other AVG/ASD person filed a sworn affidavit in the Ponzi scheme, wire fraud and money-laundering case.

    And she knows ASD said it had no money to continue operations, and now the plaintiffs are telling her millions of dollars never have been repatriated.

    Patrick

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  35. …”Naysayers are NEVER wrong”…that’s what the man said.

    Time will tell if that apparent truism is bunk.

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  36. Sicilian: alasycia,They don’t care.Plain and simple.
    Remeber David Courtney?!?His AVG videos about how “this thing is secret get in now” blah blah blah.How about Mark Simmons’ recent promotion of AVG using the Forbes name?Neither of them are saying a peep about AVG now.They got their money in, probably out, and now there is a flock left over who will get nothing.I’m not sure if Correction! and those others that come here are people who have profited and are trying to state their case for their conscience, or if they are just angry people who know that their money is lost in AVG.Either way it’s quite pathetic.

    shows what you know, I already got my money back and then some and so did the people I brought in. The only place my conscience is affected is why didn’t I put more in? they just had some big announcements which of course you clowns will scoff at but we’ll be going again soon and I’ll be making money and bringing in everyone I can.

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  37. Lynn,

    More somewhat interesting stuff on the banking problem for AVG. In a board meeting today, we had to pass a resolution concerning US banking laws and who within the corporation has legal permission to carry out all sorts of account-related actions on behalf of the corporation. This is being driven by Morgan Stanley and other large banks, and the rest will follow. It is evolving into a significant corporate governance issue, in order to ensure that the corporate officers are legitimate, tracable, and generally honorable types (Enron, Worldcom, and ASD excluded). I wonder if such affidavits were requested of AVG, and given the “status” of their insiders, the various US banks refused their business.

    Lynndel Edgington: Hey Joe. It’s the resident idiot here. Were you able to find those gmail and yahoo E-mail accounts used by AVGA? I didn’t want an idiot like me upstaging you with information I had that you didn’t. While you are it, you might want to ask Donna why they have a North Carolina UPS store address for mailing, a Florida unlisted cell phone for their customer service line, when the corporate headquarters are in Uruguay and your bank is half-way around the world? I for one would love to hear her answer.But then I am sure this is no big deal just like the RICO filing, besides what do I know? I am just the resident idiot here, right Joe?

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  38. Lynndel Edgington: Hey Joe.It’s the resident idiot here.Were you able to find those gmail and yahoo E-mail accounts used by AVGA?I didn’t want an idiot like me upstaging you with information I had that you didn’t.While you are it, you might want to ask Donna why they have a North Carolina UPS store address for mailing, a Florida unlisted cell phone for their customer service line, when the corporate headquarters are in Uruguay and your bank is half-way around the world?I for one would love to hear her answer.But then I am sure this is no big deal just like the RICO filing, besides what do I know?I am just the resident idiot here, right Joe?

    Right you are but don’t feel bad theres others. As for the emails I didn’t look for them I don’t need them. Don’t worry about upstaging me, you can’t. What because you knew about some email addresses that makes you cutting edge or something? The only time I email them is thru my back office. You are right the location of customer service is a non issue as long as they get it done but you will take any thing you can. Also the RICO filing isn’t a big deal why do you think it is? They were merely mentioned in a motion against BofA that has to do with ASD. They were used as an example thats it, they’re not a part of any lawsuit at all. Patrick’s blog was mentioned does that make him part of the lawsuit? If not why? his name was mentioned.

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  39. Entertained: Lynn,More somewhat interesting stuff on the banking problem for AVG. In a board meeting today, we had to pass a resolution concerning US banking laws and who within the corporation has legal permission to carry out all sorts of account-related actions on behalf of the corporation. This is being driven by Morgan Stanley and other large banks, and the rest will follow. It is evolving into a significant corporate governance issue, in order to ensure that the corporate officers are legitimate, tracable, and generally honorable types (Enron, Worldcom, and ASD excluded). I wonder if such affidavits were requested of AVG, and given the “status” of their insiders, the various US banks refused their business.

    Lynndel Edgington: Hey Joe. It’s the resident idiot here. Were you able to find those gmail and yahoo E-mail accounts used by AVGA? I didn’t want an idiot like me upstaging you with information I had that you didn’t. While you are it, you might want to ask Donna why they have a North Carolina UPS store address for mailing, a Florida unlisted cell phone for their customer service line, when the corporate headquarters are in Uruguay and your bank is half-way around the world? I for one would love to hear her answer.But then I am sure this is no big deal just like the RICO filing, besides what do I know? I am just the resident idiot here, right Joe?

    You have to understand, AVGA doesn’t have to abide by any banking laws. They are registered offshore, so U.S. Banking laws do not apply. Never mind they are selling their services to U.S. residents, and in their Association Agreement they say they are protected by the U.S. Constitution, as U.S. Citizens; but not subject to the legal authorities here in the U.S. So you see it is really very simple.

    Just like being mentioned in the RICO lawsuit is no big deal. It was just a passing comment. Hmmm, if it was so passing, wonder why the Plaintiff’s amended their RICO complaint to include them? I mean it was not necessary, it is no big deal, and yet they went to all the expense and trouble to include them. Silly lawyers.

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  40. Correction: Opps…Cathy G

    Just been having a couple beers by the bonfire with best friends. Has been a great evening! What’s up Correction?

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  41. Cathy G,

    You are slipping. Breaking News at AVGA and you haven’t posted it here yet in violation of copywrite laws. This is a blockbuster…remember…”Naysayers are NEVER wrong!

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  42. Correction: Cathy G,You are slipping.Breaking News at AVGA and you haven’t posted it here yet in violation of copywrite laws.This is a blockbuster…remember…”Naysayers are NEVER wrong!

    Those who are undecided as to how “Correction” and her fellow HYIP ponzi cheerleaders work may like to consider how they like to employ the “repeat a lie often enough, and it eventually becomes the truth”

    Correction likes to use a partial quote from a previous post here on Patricks’ Blog as many times as she can, hoping it eventually becomes “the truth”

    What was actually said was:

    “There’s one really, really satisfying thing about being a naysayer IN THE HYIP/AUTOSURF ARENA.

    Naysayers are NEVER wrong”

    Note the capitalized portion: “IN THE HYIP/AUTOSURF ARENA” is followed by: “Naysayers are NEVER wrong”

    Partial quotes and quoting out of context are necessary skills in a “business” where diversion and deception are tools in trade.

    Ask Unca “I was awarded a Congressional Medal” Andy.

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  43. note the elipsis…

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  44. Lynndel Edgington:

    Entertained: Lynn,More somewhat interesting stuff on the banking problem for AVG. In a board meeting today, we had to pass a resolution concerning US banking laws and who within the corporation has legal permission to carry out all sorts of account-related actions on behalf of the corporation. This is being driven by Morgan Stanley and other large banks, and the rest will follow. It is evolving into a significant corporate governance issue, in order to ensure that the corporate officers are legitimate, tracable, and generally honorable types (Enron, Worldcom, and ASD excluded). I wonder if such affidavits were requested of AVG, and given the “status” of their insiders, the various US banks refused their business.

    Lynndel Edgington: Hey Joe. It’s the resident idiot here. Were you able to find those gmail and yahoo E-mail accounts used by AVGA? I didn’t want an idiot like me upstaging you with information I had that you didn’t. While you are it, you might want to ask Donna why they have a North Carolina UPS store address for mailing, a Florida unlisted cell phone for their customer service line, when the corporate headquarters are in Uruguay and your bank is half-way around the world? I for one would love to hear her answer.But then I am sure this is no big deal just like the RICO filing, besides what do I know? I am just the resident idiot here, right Joe?

    You have to understand, AVGA doesn’t have to abide by any banking laws.They are registered offshore, so U.S. Banking laws do not apply.Never mind they are selling their services to U.S. residents, and in their Association Agreement they say they are protected by the U.S. Constitution, as U.S. Citizens; but not subject to the legal authorities here in the U.S. So you see it is really very simple.Just like being mentioned in the RICO lawsuit is no big deal.It was just a passing comment.Hmmm, if it was so passing, wonder why the Plaintiff’s amended their RICO complaint to include them?I mean it was not necessary, it is no big deal, and yet they went to all the expense and trouble to include them.Silly lawyers.

    Simple Question is AVGA being sued? Going by what I read the answer is no. If the answer is no then whats the big deal. There is a lot of news coming out of AVGA, some of it to do with papers from Washington basically stating we’re legit. I know, that’s no big deal. You’ll get all of the details from your inside scum so I don’t need to elaborate

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  45. joe: There is a lot of news coming out of AVGA, some of it to do with papers from Washington basically stating we’re legit.

    How excellent,

    I can hardly wait,

    Any bets on the obvious ?????

      (Quote)

  46. Hi Joe, Correction and Co,

    I think it is time to repeat my earlier post, which you have not answered.

    I dont know why you guys at AVGA are so bothered by what Patrick Pretty says. After all, he is only an investigative journalist (off and on line). I am even more suprised that you should worry what the public who post here say either. AND I am really shocked that anyone should even turn a hair if AVGA members posts are reproduced outside the AVGA site forum.

    You have spent weeks and months telling us that AVGA is the great legal future of advertising (albeit without any supporting data), so what possible harm can anything printed here do? If all legitimate businesses banned lively and critical observations, Microsoft would have closed their own forum years ago and gone bust as well. But they didn’t and haven’t. Thereagain, maybe they consider themselves sufficiently legitimate and therefore safe from financial ruin that they dont have to go into a panic everytime someone says boo

    Have you ever seen a Microsoft forum, guys? If Microsoft had wasted time paying attention to their criticism, their legal fees for suing for libel would have put them out of business years ago!! The same goes for a lot of other legitimate businesses who operate online.

    A mention, or side note, in a RICO motion is not a minor issue, as I suspect you well know. The side notes have been a feature of the whole ASD prosecution and have often provided some of the most interesting reading. The Judge certainly seems to have read them, judging from her own commentaries.

    If AVGA has any legality to protect, I suggest it does so now – and in the normal way, using financial and independently corroborated statistical data. Making childish ad hominem attacks on Patrick and the posters here is having a counter productive effect on AVGA’s credibility as a serious legal advertising company.

    When I am approached by companies to advertise with them I ask questions – about circulation, or readership, viewing statistics, conversion rates, and often, if it is a smaller company (always if it is an online company) I ask about the ownership and structure. The legitimate companies have never had any difficulty in answering these questions, nor demonstrate any reticence in doing so. The ones that avoid the questions do NOT get my advertising dollars. I could not get the same answers from AVGA – just a lot of waffle. I dont want to invest in an advertising company, I just want good quality viewers for my adverts who will become customers. I didnt get that from ASD in the end, I would put money on it that I wont get that from AVGA either.

      (Quote)

  47. CORRECTION!,

    How well-versed are you in copyright laws? That might be something to ponder…… The copyright laws as they apply to blog sites and sites like AVG are much the same as any other form of creative material. However, the owner of a copyright is not the site host, nor the company sponsoring the site. It is the individual author of the work in question. Further, quotations can be made freely if they are not too lengthy, paraphrasing can be done completely freely (copyright protects the style, not the expressed facts or opinions), and any facts or opinions can be freely recreated, since the copyright laws are designed to encourage opendebate and discussion. Finally, information posted that is actually public domain information (perhaps your “breaking news out of Washington”) cannot be copyrighted.

    Correction: Cathy G,You are slipping. Breaking News at AVGA and you haven’t posted it here yet in violation of copywrite laws. This is a blockbuster…remember…”Naysayers are NEVER wrong!

      (Quote)

  48. Joe,

    You really are a brilliant person. You don’t see the “big deal” in being named in a RICO lawsuit. You openly admit you and others profited from a ponzi scheme. You really remind me of that tub-butt scammer Mark Simmons! You guys should get together.

      (Quote)

  49. Joe,

    joe: There is a lot of news coming out of AVGA, some of it to do with papers from Washington basically stating we’re legit.

    Papers from “Washington” stating AVG “basically” is legit?

    And, if I’m reading CORRECTION! correctly, he can’t post good news about AVG here because it is copyrighted?

    AVG could benefit from good news out of Washington, because of its monumental PR difficulties.

    Let’s examine the PR problems:

    AVG is an offshore “private association” formed after consulting with a convicted felon. It says it is based in Uruguay, but its servers resolve to Panama, and it issues news releases with a dateline of Tallahassee, Fla. It uses a business model associated with securities fraud, wire fraud, money-laundering and Ponzi schemes. It has management, promoters, insiders and members in common with AdSurfDaily, whose assets were seized last year in a securities-fraud, wire-fraud, money-laundering and Ponzi scheme investigation.

    Big PR problem to overcome.

    AVG currently has suspended cash-outs, made an 80/20 program mandatory and has exercised the “rebates aren’t guaranteed” clause, which gives an Andy Bowdoin family member the right to keep all the money. AVG recently released a promo that claimed a 37-percent conversion rate, as long as the sales copy of the “advertiser” didn’t “totally suck.” It paints the picture that Staples is one of its advertisers, and suggests that a person who watches the ads for six months will get back 100 percent of his or her ad spend, plus a profit of 10 percent, in 180 days — up from the previous 150 days, and now increased to 210 days.

    Big PR problem to overcome.

    AVG, led by Bowdoin/Harris family members whose assets were seized in a federal forfeiture complaint, currently is auditing itself to determine the extent of theft caused by the misuse of a member-to-member cash button and has claimed it will take at least 30 days to complete the audit. Meanwhile, AVG’s name now has been used in a RICO filing against Andy Bowdoin to illustrate an alleged pattern of racketeering, and Andy Bowdoin has a history of announcing audit findings that determined, among other things, that Russian “hackers” had stolen $1 million from the firm and that ASD had overpaid members, thus making itself insolvent and leading to the suspension of member cash-outs.

    Big PR problem to overcome.

    The same Andy Bowdoin didn’t file a police report to bring the purported $1 million theft to the attention of investigators, and he didn’t ask members who’d been overpaid owing to a purported script error to return the funds — but later publicized a $10,000 stock offering and restarted the surf under a different name, not telling new members they were paying for the disaster that was the first iteration of ASD.

    Big PR problem to overcome.

    But now AVG has “papers from Washington basically stating we’re legit,” but people who share the news are “inside scum.”

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  50. CORRECTION & Little Joe:

    I Jack Arons do hereby swear that I will post everything that I find concerning AVGA and will send copies of same to all Law Enforcement in any state that AVGA claims to have an address, phone number or anything else. I also promise that I will verify, seek out and copy so called copyrighted material(US Copyright Office has no knowledge of any copyrights associated to AVGA).

    Jack Arons
    850.421.5791

    Please see that the idiots running AVGA see this post. Also, give my regards to Andy!!!!!!!!!!!

      (Quote)

  51. Anytime someone tells me that AVG has absolutely no affiliation with the late and illegal ASD, it makes me wonder why they even mention it as the signs are everywhere. It’s bad enough that the have the same persons involved, even worse that they have put their fate in the hands of “Life Coaches” (BS Artists), then they have to say the same crap that ASD said when they start having problems:

    We have consulted with lawyers and securities experts, and have formalized the agreements with the necessary partners to facilitate our new plans.

    Just like ASD, you should have thought of this BEFORE you had problems !!

    There are sweeping changes coming to AVGA, and here is a summary of them:

    1. No time limit on VIP, instead a fixed 25% profit
    2. Outside Revenue Streams and why we are 100% Legal

    Oh, so NOW you guarantee rebates/VIP at 25% with no time limit? You can’t even pay cash out’s now!! Blowing smoke up someone’s skirt does not a profit make. I wonder if Robert Garner checked their legality, just like he did for Andy since Andy owns this one, too.

      (Quote)

  52. …one more thing on copyright laws. Anything that is posted at the AVG site that is factual or is opinion can be reposted without violating any copyright laws. It is only the creative element that is protected. So CORRECTION!, unless the information posted on AVGA is creative writing (ie not factual), it can be reposted here. That probably means it can’t be reported here. Oh my, what a dilemna for Correction! and Joe! If the AVG site info is true, it can be reposted, if false, it can’t…..

    Entertained: CORRECTION!,How well-versed are you in copyright laws? ………

      (Quote)

  53. Sickening how hard Jack worked to help bring down ASD and then Bowdoin’s step-son starts this crap up.

    Those followers who sent brownies and cards and what not are too stupid to see that he is laughing at them.

    I wonder if they still repeat those daily “thank you god for making me a money magnet” lines that he pimped at the Vegas rally.

    And Joe,

    Read Patricks last post carefully. “Basically Legit?” I think you are basically missing a few chromosones in your brain.

      (Quote)

  54. Just a little insight into the Bowdoin/Harris psych.

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5myd3_mr-andy-bowdoin-speaks-ad-surf-dail_webcam

      (Quote)

  55. Sicilian,

    You are misreading Joe. He knows exactly what is going on, and his posts are designed to linehis own pockets with more victims’ money. He’s not dumb….

    Sicilian: And Joe,Read Patricks last post carefully. “Basically Legit?” I think you are basically missing a few chromosones in your brain.

      (Quote)

  56. Entertained,

    I read that the MCC cell that housed Madoff had the windows blacked out so they couldn’t see outside. The same unit almost “broke” John Gotti Jr. according to his own statements.

    I really want to see some prosecutions soon. I’m betting the guys like “Joe”, Mark Simmons, Bowdoin, etc. wont last 15 minutes in a cell. I’m willing to wager that Gotti Jr. is a tad tougher than any of the above clowns.

      (Quote)

  57. Sicilian: Joe,You really are a brilliant person.You don’t see the “big deal” in being named in a RICO lawsuit.You openly admit you and others profited from a ponzi scheme.You really remind me of that tub-butt scammer Mark Simmons!You guys should get together.

    Do you have his number?

      (Quote)

  58. Sicilian: Sickening how hard Jack worked to help bring down ASD and then Bowdoin’s step-son starts this crap up.Those followers who sent brownies and cards and what not are too stupid to see that he is laughing at them.I wonder if they still repeat those daily “thank you god for making me a money magnet” lines that he pimped at the Vegas rally.And Joe,Read Patricks last post carefully.“Basically Legit?”I think you are basically missing a few chromosones in your brain.

    Read it again I said “Basically saying” we are legit. I love how you jump on a simple word and try to use it as evidence into infinity. Do you like Jazz? Ever hear of Charlie Parker? Great sax player, he could take a little 2 note phrase and turn it into an improvisational symphony, but at least he was fascinating.

      (Quote)

  59. admin: Joe,

    joe: There is a lot of news coming out of AVGA, some of it to do with papers from Washington basically stating we’re legit.

    Papers from “Washington” stating AVG “basically” is legit?And, if I’m reading CORRECTION! correctly, he can’t post good news about AVG here because it is copyrighted?AVG could benefit from good news out of Washington, because of its monumental PR difficulties.Let’s examine the PR problems:AVG is an offshore “private association” formed after consulting with a convicted felon. It says it is based in Uruguay, but its servers resolve to Panama, and it issues news releases with a dateline of Tallahassee, Fla. It uses a business model associated with securities fraud, wire fraud, money-laundering and Ponzi schemes. It has management, promoters, insiders and members in common with AdSurfDaily, whose assets were seized last year in a securities-fraud, wire-fraud, money-laundering and Ponzi scheme investigation.Big PR problem to overcome.AVG currently has suspended cash-outs, made an 80/20 program mandatory and has exercised the “rebates aren’t guaranteed” clause, which gives an Andy Bowdoin family member the right to keep all the money. AVG recently released a promo that claimed a 37-percent conversion rate, as long as the sales copy of the “advertiser” didn’t “totally suck.” It paints the picture that Staples is one of its advertisers, and suggests that a person who watches the ads for six months will get back 100 percent of his or her ad spend, plus a profit of 10 percent, in 180 days — up from the previous 150 days, and now increased to 210 days.Big PR problem to overcome.
    AVG, led by Bowdoin/Harris family members whose assets were seized in a federal forfeiture complaint, currently is auditing itself to determine the extent of theft caused by the misuse of a member-to-member cash button and has claimed it will take at least 30 days to complete the audit. Meanwhile, AVG’s name now has been used in a RICO filing against Andy Bowdoin to illustrate an alleged pattern of racketeering, and Andy Bowdoin has a history of announcing audit findings that determined, among other things, that Russian “hackers” had stolen $1 million from the firm and that ASD had overpaid members, thus making itself insolvent and leading to the suspension of member cash-outs.Big PR problem to overcome.The same Andy Bowdoin didn’t file a police report to bring the purported $1 million theft to the attention of investigators, and he didn’t ask members who’d been overpaid owing to a purported script error to return the funds — but later publicized a $10,000 stock offering and restarted the surf under a different name, not telling new members they were paying for the disaster that was the first iteration of ASD.Big PR problem to overcome.But now AVG has “papers from Washington basically stating we’re legit,” but people who share the news are “inside scum.”Patrick

    I said basically stating. shouldn’t have used a word you can slip in to a different sequence.

      (Quote)

  60. Ok, Joe and Correction, here’s a quiz for both of you. Take this to Donna~

    Let’s say there are 20,000 members who all want to earn $500.00 per day. I realize that is conservative as there are those that believe they will be making $1000’s per day. But let’s just use $500.00.

    20,000 members x $500.00 a day = $10,000,000.00 per day. That is 10 million dollars.
    Now take that x 30 (one month)= $300,000,000.00 That is 300 million per month.
    So, do you really think that AVGA and all of it’s “new” outside sources of income can possibly bring in 300 million per month just to pay out on $500 a day.
    But again, they would probably have to pay with new members money. Which of course is illegal.

      (Quote)

  61. You are correct in that it would be considered legit if there was $300 million dollars per month in outside revenue. Now that would be some kind of company selling banners and business cards.

    Cathy G.: Ok, Joe and Correction, here’s a quiz for both of you. Take this to Donna~Let’s say there are 20,000 members who all want to earn $500.00 per day. I realize that is conservative as there are those that believe they will be making $1000’s per day. But let’s just use $500.00.20,000 members x $500.00 a day = $10,000,000.00 per day. That is 10 million dollars.Now take that x 30 (one month)= $300,000,000.00 That is 300 million per month.So, do you really think that AVGA and all of it’s “new” outside sources of income can possibly bring in 300 million per month just to pay out on $500 a day.But again, they would probably have to pay with new members money. Which of course is illegal.

      (Quote)

  62. Cathy G.,

    Andy’s Vegas-flogged, 100,000-millionaires plan in three years would have required annual revenue in excess of numbers posted by IBM just to pay the millionaires ASD was creating. (IBM’s annual revenue is approximately $100 billion.)

    In other words, ASD would had to have gone from insolvency to $100 billion in annual sales in three years, assuming it had no other expenses.

    IBM, by the way, requires about 386,500 employees to operate its business.

    Andy’s plan also would have required him to more than double the annual revenue posted by Time Warner in three years just to pay the millionaires. Time Warner has about 86,000 employees and posts annual revenue of about $46 billion.

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  63. Just go to http://www.unemployablehobo.com, Joe. You two can make friends and see who can scam the most. Do you like teddy bears by chance?

    And keep pimping your ponzi scheme here. You’ve already shown your incredible lack of intelligence, are you dumb enough to realize that the Feds probably track all these boards and know exactly who you are?

    How much did you “make” from AVG again?

      (Quote)

  64. Cathy G.,

    Another way to look at the ASD three-year plan to create 100,000 millionaires:

    ASD, just to pay the millionaires it was creating, would have to become one of the Top 50 companies in the world in three years’ time — while having no hosting expenses or other expenses and the ability to serve ads by the tens of billions.

    Revenue-wise, it would need to be become bigger than Verizon and only slightly smaller than AT&T, for example. It would need to be bigger than Nestlé, and it would need to be more than twice the size of companies such as Sprint and Canon.

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  65. Sicilian: Just go to http://www.unemployablehobo.com, Joe.You two can make friends and see who can scam the most.Do you like teddy bears by chance?And keep pimping your ponzi scheme here.You’ve already shown your incredible lack of intelligence, are you dumb enough to realize that the Feds probably track all these boards and know exactly who you are?How much did you “make” from AVG again?

    Yep I’m pretty dumb alright but then how am I going to look intelligent when I have to compare to your vast mind.

      (Quote)

  66. Cathy G.: You are correct in that it would be considered legit if there was $300 million dollars per month in outside revenue.Now that would be some kind of company selling banners and business cards.

    Cathy G.: Ok, Joe and Correction, here’s a quiz for both of you. Take this to Donna~Let’s say there are 20,000 members who all want to earn $500.00 per day. I realize that is conservative as there are those that believe they will be making $1000’s per day. But let’s just use $500.00.20,000 members x $500.00 a day = $10,000,000.00 per day. That is 10 million dollars.Now take that x 30 (one month)= $300,000,000.00 That is 300 million per month.So, do you really think that AVGA and all of it’s “new” outside sources of income can possibly bring in 300 million per month just to pay out on $500 a day.But again, they would probably have to pay with new members money. Which of course is illegal.

    Well you really need to get up to date on the plan there and you should be able to being a member.

      (Quote)

  67. Sicilian: Entertained,I read that the MCC cell that housed Madoff had the windows blacked out so they couldn’t see outside.The same unit almost “broke” John Gotti Jr. according to his own statements.I really want to see some prosecutions soon.I’m betting the guys like “Joe”, Mark Simmons, Bowdoin, etc. wont last 15 minutes in a cell.I’m willing to wager that Gotti Jr. is a tad tougher than any of the above clowns.

    I’ve done a lot tougher time than that.

      (Quote)

  68. Actually I found the statement from AVGA which said, “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY.” most interesting. It makes you ask the question “transformed” from what?

      (Quote)

  69. Lynndel Edgington: Actually I found the statement from AVGA which said, “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY.” most interesting.It makes you ask the question “transformed” from what?

    They weren’t full service before,, just Ad Rotator c’mon even you are better than that.

      (Quote)

  70. joe:

    Cathy G.: You are correct in that it would be considered legit if there was $300 million dollars per month in outside revenue.Now that would be some kind of company selling banners and business cards.

    Cathy G.: Ok, Joe and Correction, here’s a quiz for both of you. Take this to Donna~Let’s say there are 20,000 members who all want to earn $500.00 per day. I realize that is conservative as there are those that believe they will be making $1000’s per day. But let’s just use $500.00.20,000 members x $500.00 a day = $10,000,000.00 per day. That is 10 million dollars.Now take that x 30 (one month)= $300,000,000.00 That is 300 million per month.So, do you really think that AVGA and all of it’s “new” outside sources of income can possibly bring in 300 million per month just to pay out on $500 a day.But again, they would probably have to pay with new members money. Which of course is illegal.

    Well you really need to get up to date on the plan there and you should be able to being a member.

    Come on Joe you gotta be kidding right? You really believe they can sell $300 million a month? And that’s being conservative.

      (Quote)

  71. admin: Big PR problem to overcome.

    You forgot one Patrick, there was the small matter that Uncle Andy was claiming that ASD had no money and needed emergency relief to continue operating. But all the time there was $1M in the Caribbean, hidden away by Honest Andy.

    Big PR problem to overcome. I think anyway.

    —-

    Joe is right. Being mentioned in a RICO lawsuit is no big deal. After all, when a company uses a similar business model to an illegal operation, has many of the same operators as the illegal operation, has had several banking issues (just like the illegal operation), has to audit it’s members for fraud, and has been promoted by serial ponzi promoters, after all this, a mention in the RICO suit is a small thing. Just one more “red flag” amongst many.

      (Quote)

  72. Hi Tony,

    Tony H: You forgot one Patrick, there was the small matter that Uncle Andy was claiming that ASD had no money and needed emergency relief to continue operating. But all the time there was $1M in the Caribbean, hidden away by Honest Andy.

    Heck, Tony, that is a good one. He didn’t remember the money until the prosecutors reminded him he had it.

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  73. So Joe you’ve already done time? Nice. Can I be in your downline?

    LOL Patrick. Honest Andy. I’ll never forget when Laura Pont said Andy was too honest to testify.

      (Quote)

  74. Cathy G.:

    joe:

    Cathy G.: You are correct in that it would be considered legit if there was $300 million dollars per month in outside revenue.Now that would be some kind of company selling banners and business cards.

    Cathy G.: Ok, Joe and Correction, here’s a quiz for both of you. Take this to Donna~Let’s say there are 20,000 members who all want to earn $500.00 per day. I realize that is conservative as there are those that believe they will be making $1000’s per day. But let’s just use $500.00.20,000 members x $500.00 a day = $10,000,000.00 per day. That is 10 million dollars.Now take that x 30 (one month)= $300,000,000.00 That is 300 million per month.So, do you really think that AVGA and all of it’s “new” outside sources of income can possibly bring in 300 million per month just to pay out on $500 a day.But again, they would probably have to pay with new members money. Which of course is illegal.

    Well you really need to get up to date on the plan there and you should be able to being a member.

    Come on Joe you gotta be kidding right?You really believe they can sell $300 million a month?And that’s being conservative.

    No, what I’m trying to figure out is who ever said 20,000 members were going to make 500 dollars a day? Your example is wildly hypotehetical. As for the pay plan, it’s 25% on top of whatever cash you put in. If you put in enough to make 500 a day then fantastic. You’re a member read the news.

      (Quote)

  75. I noticed another quote on another forum that said the time limits were gone. This poster said that they could then payout 1% over 25 years. There’s your 25% Joe!

    Call me in 25 years and tell me how AVG is doing!

      (Quote)

  76. Sicilian: I noticed another quote on another forum that said the time limits were gone.This poster said that they could then payout 1% over 25 years.There’s your 25% Joe!Call me in 25 years and tell me how AVG is doing!

    If you beleive that you are just as hypothetical as Cathy

      (Quote)

  77. Tony H:

    admin: Big PR problem to overcome.

    You forgot one Patrick, there was the small matter that Uncle Andy was claiming that ASD had no money and needed emergency relief to continue operating. But all the time there was $1M in the Caribbean, hidden away by Honest Andy.
    Big PR problem to overcome. I think anyway.—-Joe is right. Being mentioned in a RICO lawsuit is no big deal. After all, when a company uses a similar business model to an illegal operation, has many of the same operators as the illegal operation, has had several banking issues (just like the illegal operation), has to audit it’s members for fraud, and has been promoted by serial ponzi promoters, after all this, a mention in the RICO suit is a small thing. Just one more “red flag” amongst many.

    Finally, my point taken.

      (Quote)

  78. So Joe, you don’t think that all 20,000 members hope to be making $500.00 or more per day?

      (Quote)

  79. joe:

    Lynndel Edgington: Actually I found the statement from AVGA which said, “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY.” most interesting.It makes you ask the question “transformed” from what?

    They weren’t full service before,, just Ad Rotator c’mon even you are better than that.

    Aw, little joe, the correct word would be expanded or diversify, not transformed.

    You know better than that.

    Big Joe

      (Quote)

  80. joe:

    No, what I’m trying to figure out is who ever said 20,000 members were going to make 500 dollars a day? Your example is wildly hypotehetical. As for the pay plan, it’s 25% on top of whatever cash you put in. If you put in enough to make 500 a day then fantastic. You’re a member read the news.

    Aw, little joe, there you have it. “…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.

    What say you now?

    Big Joe

      (Quote)

  81. joe:

    Lynndel Edgington: Actually I found the statement from AVGA which said, “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY.” most interesting.It makes you ask the question “transformed” from what?

    They weren’t full service before,, just Ad Rotator c’mon even you are better than that.

    Well, Joe;

    Let’s look at the full context for the “transformed” statement from Donna:

    “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY. We are NOT an “ad rotators” or a ponzi scheme. AVGA sells web based services and advertising. We are offering advertising with a 25% profit through revenue sharing as a loss leader for our services, consulting and other products.”

    That certainly suggests to me that she’s aware that AVG was an “…”ad rotators” or a ponzi scheme.”, but has now been transformed into a “FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY”

    Thus the answer to the question of “transformed into what?” seems to be right there in her own words, which have now been removed from the AVG site by the way.

      (Quote)

  82. Edit: Thus the answer to the question of “transformed into what?” above should read:

    Thus the answer to the question of “transformed FROM what?”

      (Quote)

  83. joe: Finally, my point taken.

    Joe, I’m glad that you agree that there are vary many “red flags” that indicate that AVG is a ponzi scheme similar to the illegal operation that was ASD. Yes, I take your point that all these indicators show that AVG must be an illegal operation as well because of all the similarities with ASD. The same principles involved, a similar business model, many of the same promoters. I’m glad that you agree that AVG is obviously a similar illegal operation to ASD and that no one in their right mind should be entertaining the thought of sending them any money.

    As you agree with the above points, I’m sure that you will also agree that AVG is doomed to failure, in the same way that ASD, CEP, PhoenixSurf, 12DailyPro, PIPS, GINS, PlexPay, and all the other HYIP & AutoSurfs that have failed in recent years.

    —-

    @Patrick, yes, I’m alwaqys forgetting money I’ve left around. Down the back of the sofa, hidden away in off shore accounts in the Caribbean, it’s so easy to forget these things.

      (Quote)

  84. Joe;

    You said, “No, what I’m trying to figure out is who ever said 20,000 members were going to make 500 dollars a day? Your example is wildly hypotehetical.”

    I agree. However, here’s a direct quote from Donna in the (now removed) announcement about the changes being made.

    “AVGA’s problem is going to be keeping up with the demand for services and advertising placed on it when AVGA explodes from 20,000 to 500,000 members

    AVGA problem is going to be too much success”

    Now the observers here can play with mumbers based upon Donna’s hypothetical. Perhaps that will be more acceptable to to you. For example, if 500,000 members were to average only $100 per month, that would be a total of $50 million per month or $600 million per year. Since AVG pays out only 50% of what it takes in, it would require double the above numbers in revenue to support those payouts.

    Regarding the “25% on top” you refer to:

    The revised AVG payout plan takes us back to the math issue that haunted ASD. Various sophisticated analyses were made and debated endlessly on the ASD Surf’s Up forum. However, my rather simplified analogy regarding the new AVG math works as follows. Someone who says they are based in Uruguay makes you an offer:

    1) You send them gallons of milk. For every gallon you send them they will keep two quarts and send five quarts back to you.

    2) If you get others to send them gallons of milk they will pay you a commission.

    3) If those 2nd tier people send them gallons of milk they will pay you a commission on those participants, too.

    That is, in essence, the deal that is now being offered by AVG. It didn’t make mathematical sense when it was ASD and it makes no sense now that it’s been adopted by AVG.

      (Quote)

  85. Joe:

    joe:

    Lynndel Edgington: Actually I found the statement from AVGA which said, “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY.” most interesting.It makes you ask the question “transformed” from what?

    They weren’t full service before,, just Ad Rotator c’mon even you are better than that.

    Aw, little joe, the correct word would be expanded or diversify, not transformed.You know better than that.Big Joe

    What’s wrong with transformed? There’s certainly nothing definitively wrong with it. Kinda petty wouldn’t ya say? There you go Patrick Petty. Actually I’ve been waiting to use that.

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  86. Pat Dunn: Joe;You said, “No, what I’m trying to figure out is who ever said 20,000 members were going to make 500 dollars a day? Your example is wildly hypotehetical.”I agree. However, here’s a direct quote from Donna in the (now removed) announcement about the changes being made.
    “AVGA’s problem is going to be keeping up with the demand for services and advertising placed on it when AVGA explodes from 20,000 to 500,000 membersAVGA problem is going to be too much success”Now the observers here can play with mumbers based upon Donna’s hypothetical. Perhaps that will be more acceptable to to you. For example, if 500,000 members were to average only $100 per month, that would be a total of $50 million per month or $600 million per year. Since AVG pays out only 50% of what it takes in, it would require double the above numbers in revenue to support those payouts.Regarding the “25% on top” you refer to:The revised AVG payout plan takes us back to the math issue that haunted ASD. Various sophisticated analyses were made and debated endlessly on the ASD Surf’s Up forum. However, my rather simplified analogy regarding the new AVG math works as follows. Someone who says they are based in Uruguay makes you an offer:1) You send them gallons of milk. For every gallon you send them they will keep two quarts and send five quarts back to you.2) If you get others to send them gallons of milk they will pay you a commission.3) If those 2nd tier people send them gallons of milk they will pay you a commission on those participants, too.That is, in essence, the deal that is now being offered by AVG. It didn’t make mathematical sense when it was ASD and it makes no sense now that it’s been adopted by AVG.

    Pat Dunn: Joe;You said, “No, what I’m trying to figure out is who ever said 20,000 members were going to make 500 dollars a day? Your example is wildly hypotehetical.”I agree. However, here’s a direct quote from Donna in the (now removed) announcement about the changes being made.
    “AVGA’s problem is going to be keeping up with the demand for services and advertising placed on it when AVGA explodes from 20,000 to 500,000 membersAVGA problem is going to be too much success”Now the observers here can play with mumbers based upon Donna’s hypothetical. Perhaps that will be more acceptable to to you. For example, if 500,000 members were to average only $100 per month, that would be a total of $50 million per month or $600 million per year. Since AVG pays out only 50% of what it takes in, it would require double the above numbers in revenue to support those payouts.Regarding the “25% on top” you refer to:The revised AVG payout plan takes us back to the math issue that haunted ASD. Various sophisticated analyses were made and debated endlessly on the ASD Surf’s Up forum. However, my rather simplified analogy regarding the new AVG math works as follows. Someone who says they are based in Uruguay makes you an offer:1) You send them gallons of milk. For every gallon you send them they will keep two quarts and send five quarts back to you.2) If you get others to send them gallons of milk they will pay you a commission.3) If those 2nd tier people send them gallons of milk they will pay you a commission on those participants, too.That is, in essence, the deal that is now being offered by AVG. It didn’t make mathematical sense when it was ASD and it makes no sense now that it’s been adopted by AVG.

    a very simplified and incorrect analogy. You’re forgetting the milk sent by outside sources and also the fact that like any company they have external investments that bring in more milk.

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  87. Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

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  88. Joe:

    joe:

    Lynndel Edgington: Actually I found the statement from AVGA which said, “AVGA has transformed into a FULL SERVICE ADVERTISING COMPANY.” most interesting.It makes you ask the question “transformed” from what?

    They weren’t full service before,, just Ad Rotator c’mon even you are better than that.

    Aw, little joe, the correct word would be expanded or diversify, not transformed.You know better than that.Big Joe

    I’m not sure if you’re big or not but I have to admit you do sound kind of BIg and Dumb

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  89. Cathy G.: So Joe, you don’t think that all 20,000 members hope to be making $500.00 or more per day?

    We all would wouldn’t you? Kind of an obvious question there. Do I think we’ll have that many making that kind of money? probably not unless you do what needs to be done to do that and some will.

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  90. joe:

    Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

    little joe, a Freudian slip? Yes, little joe wrong again. I could not have said it better myself.

    Big Joe

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  91. Joe,

    joe: Kinda petty wouldn’t ya say?

    Is it as petty as this (accidental/deliberate?) dispatch I received via email last night:

    “Hey [Name], I probably shouldn’t tell you this but I really decided to take your advice and stay away from PP but I wanted one last look and well, your name was mentioned again. It;s on this ridiculous breaking news thing about AVGA cited in ASD case making it sound like they were in trouble. Now I see what you mean about him. After I read the actual story AVG was merely mentioned in a side note. Anyway I just thought i would tell you, then again you probably don’t give a shit and we should just ignore them. I did call him chickenshit on his forum though.”

    Patrick

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  92. joe: I have to admit you do sound kind of BIg and Dumb

    ?

    admin: I did call him chickenshit on his forum though.

    It’s good to see that AVG supporters have such a professional attitude and can present their position with such logical argument. Supported with data and considered opinions as shown above, why would anyone not want to “invest” in AVG. I think I might have $1M in Antigua that I forgot about, I will be using that to buy “ad packs”, no wait, “page impressions”, right away.

    I’m a little confused. Perhaps Joe or one of the AVG supporters can clarify for me. What will be the return on my investment? And when should I expect to see a profit?

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  93. joe: a very simplified and incorrect analogy. You’re forgetting the milk sent by outside sources and also the fact that like any company they have external investments that bring in more milk.

    Well, Joe, that raises a couple of new issues:

    1) You say they have such outside revenues, but how do you know that isn’t just smoke and mirrors fed to you by the wizards behind the curtain? After all, the new affiliation just happened; have there been any sales of these outside services that you personally know of?

    2) Assume for a moment that outside revenues exist in the amounts needed to support paying out $1.25 for every dollar spent by members on ads. If you owned a business that had that much profit, would you be willing to distribute it to anyone else?

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  94. ….so, now there are sweeping changes coming to AVG. These sweeping changes, stated by the company, are that AVG will soon have external revenue and thus be 100% legal. I guess that means that up to now they have not had external revenue and were not legal. Nice for them to say so……but not a surprise. I am sure there will be a CORRECTION! on this one, but the English is pretty clear. You’d think that a highly professional company, and an expert communicator like Donna, would be EXTREMELY careful in their communications in situations like this. Here they are, accused by many of being an illegal Ponzi scheme, and then then put out a statement that essentially admits they have been illegal up to this point. They really should get their communications act together, if they want to be credible. OTOH….

    Leo Smith: “……There are sweeping changes coming to AVGA, and here is a summary of them:1. No time limit on VIP, instead a fixed 25% profit2. Outside Revenue Streams and why we are 100% Legal ….

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  95. …..well, that does explain why you feel no remorse for taking money from new victims in AVG. You are already familiar and comfortable with a life of crime it seems. What a great role model and spokesman you are for AVG, as I am sure readers of this blog can see.

    joe:

    Sicilian: Entertained,I read that the MCC cell that housed Madoff had the windows blacked out so they couldn’t see outside.The same unit almost “broke” John Gotti Jr. according to his own statements.I really want to see some prosecutions soon.I’m betting the guys like “Joe”, Mark Simmons, Bowdoin, etc. wont last 15 minutes in a cell.I’m willing to wager that Gotti Jr. is a tad tougher than any of the above clowns.

    I’ve done a lot tougher time than that.

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  96. Fact???? Conjecture at best. You have already admitted you don’t have proof of external revenue, and now you state as fact that AVG has external investment…..prove it.

    joe

    a very simplified and incorrect analogy. You’re forgetting the milk sent by outside sources and also the fact that like any company they have external investments that bring in more milk.

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  97. Plenty of lawyers — right. They don’t even understand basic copyright law…..

    joe:

    Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

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  98. joe:

    Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

    So can you come up with any names of the lawyers and SEC experts?
    As I recall, Andy the man had a team of lawyers and SEC experts and we know what happened there.

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  99. Entertained: …..well, that does explain why you feel no remorse for taking money from new victims in AVG.You are already familiar and comfortable with a life of crime it seems.What a great role model and spokesman you are for AVG, as I am sure readers of this blog can see.

    joe:

    Sicilian: Entertained,I read that the MCC cell that housed Madoff had the windows blacked out so they couldn’t see outside.The same unit almost “broke” John Gotti Jr. according to his own statements.I really want to see some prosecutions soon.I’m betting the guys like “Joe”, Mark Simmons, Bowdoin, etc. wont last 15 minutes in a cell.I’m willing to wager that Gotti Jr. is a tad tougher than any of the above clowns.

    I’ve done a lot tougher time than that.

    If you must know I was referring to the 2 years i spent as a POW in Vietnam which I really didn’t want to get into and still don’t. That’s one time I should have kept my mouth shut.

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  100. joe,

    My sincere apologies! I have an acquaintence who went through the same thing as a downed aviator. I saw him gibe a small public speech on his experience. An incredibly moving, emotional speech. You must be strong to have come through that, and many in our country are very grateful (including me).

    He was

    joe:

    Entertained:……

    If you must know I was referring to the 2 years i spent as a POW in Vietnam which I really didn’t want to get into and still don’t. That’s one time I should have kept my mouth shut.

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  101. Joe:

    joe:

    Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

    little joe, a Freudian slip?Yes, little joe wrong again.I could not have said it better myself.Big Joe

    I knew a guy who called himself big Joe once, it was a joke, he was a little guy and he also got one of those penis enlargements. He had to so the girls would quit laughing at him. You sound kind of like him, I wonder why. Your name isn’t even listed in the heading as big Joe so to add it later is funny. You look kinda stupid with that.

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  102. joe:

    Joe:

    joe:

    Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

    little joe, a Freudian slip?Yes, little joe wrong again.I could not have said it better myself.Big Joe

    I knew a guy who called himself big Joe once, it was a joke, he was a little guy and he also got one of those penis enlargements. He had to so the girls would quit laughing at him. You sound kind of like him, I wonder why. Your name isn’t even listed in the heading as big Joe so to add it later is funny. You look kinda stupid with that.

    Aw, little joe let me explain it for you. Quite simple really.

    you use the name “joe” with a lower-case “j”, I use the name “Joe” with a capital “J”. Therefore to keep separate who is who, I referred to you as little joe and me as Big Joe.

    Nothing else to read into that. Thought you would have figured it out.

    Sorry about the confusion.

    Big Joe

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  103. Joe:

    joe:

    Joe:

    joe:

    Joe: joe:Aw, little joe, there you have it.“…25% on top..” puts this in the class of securities and must be registered with the SEC to be legit.What say you now?Big Joe

    No it doesn’t put it in the class of securities, sorry little joe wrong again you obviously can’t comprehend that they aren’t going to make that stupid of a mistake. They have plenty of lawyers working on this and anybody that doesn’t think so can’t be too bright.

    little joe, a Freudian slip?Yes, little joe wrong again.I could not have said it better myself.Big Joe

    I knew a guy who called himself big Joe once, it was a joke, he was a little guy and he also got one of those penis enlargements. He had to so the girls would quit laughing at him. You sound kind of like him, I wonder why. Your name isn’t even listed in the heading as big Joe so to add it later is funny. You look kinda stupid with that.

    Aw, little joe let me explain it for you.Quite simple really.you use the name “joe” with a lower-case “j”, I use the name “Joe” with a capital “J”.Therefore to keep separate who is who, I referred to you as little joe and me as Big Joe.Nothing else to read into that.Thought you would have figured it out.Sorry about the confusion.Big Joe

    You’re the only one confused, it’s obvious the spelling is different but you know on second thought you are right, most of your fellow patrickites probably do need it spelled out for them.

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  104. Gee, if they’re bringing in all this outside revenue, something tells the accountant in me that they must be paying a of tax on it (before they “profit share it, too) which means that in order to keep half, pay out 125%, and pay what would be 42% in corporate income tax, plus 5% in banking/processing fees etc… they must be realizing revenue in the neighborhood of a few billion a year. Hmm,,,wondering why that’s not showing up in any public records.

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