WRETCHED, TAWDRY AND CHEAP: AdSurfDaily Members Now Targeted In Pitches For An MLM 2X2 Cycler — One That Trades On Walmart’s Name While Affiliate Offers ‘Blessings’

UPDATED 7:11 P.M. EDT (U.S.A.) When U.S. District Judge James Rosenbaum sentenced Ponzi schemer Trevor Cook to a quarter of a century in federal prison earlier this week, the judge used some powerful words to describe Cook’s colossal fraud.

Rosenbaum described the scheme that bilked investors out of at least $158 million as “wretched, tawdry and cheap.” Some of the victims were rendered destitute.

It’s easy to see why a federal judge would use such words. Not only did Cook steal by the tens of millions of dollars, he stole even after the SEC and the CFTC went to court last November to bring the scheme to a halt. Cook spent money that had been frozen by court order, thus thumbing his nose at both victims and the judicial system. He later failed to disclose the whereabouts of assets — this until he failed a lie-detector test.

All of those acts — and the $190 million scheme itself — easily qualify as “wretched, tawdry and cheap.” One could argue rationally that even stronger adjectives could be applied to Cook’s behavior and still fall within the bounds of decorum.

And this brings us to the subject of AdSurfDaily — specifically, what at least one member appears to be doing to recruit former ASD members and people interested in ASD into yet-another scheme.

That’s been done before, of course. AdViewGlobal, itself a scheme that could be described fairly as “wretched, tawdry and cheap,” rose from ASD’s ashes to bilk anew.

Along those lines, who could forget MegaLido? It was yet another autosurf that became popular in the aftermath of the domestic seizure of tens of millions of dollars in the ASD Ponzi case. One former ASD member described MegaLido as “fool proof.”

It’s “OFFSHORE!!!” he exclaimed.

Some ASD members also saddled up and starting promoting the Noobing autosurf, which targeted people with hearing impairments. There were plenty of HYIPs, too. These included Genius Funds, believed to have gathered up more than $400 million; Gold Nugget Invest, which promoted itself as a betting arbitrage and later implied in was in Forex; and CashTanker, which used an image of Jesus in its sales pitch.

Look here to see a list of some of the “programs” promoted by ASD members. (Most of the programs, by the way, were promoted after the ASD seizure.)

How To Irritate A Sleeping Dog

At 9:05 p.m. yesterday, Maddy the Wonder Puppy — always and forever a wonder puppy in my mind, even though she’s two now — was going through her endearing presleep maneuvers under my desk. This is one of those things that make me feel good about the world.

As Maddy was going through her positioning dance and stretching and yawning routine, an email popped into my box. It proved to be one of those things that make me feel bad about the world.

“input on opportunity” — all lowercase — was the subject line of the email. So, I knew right away that I was about to get a sales pitch — and I suspected before opening it that was going to a disingenuous pitch at that.

“I used to belong to ASD,” the email began. “Need your input on UniqueBuyingClub.”

OK. Here’s what’s important so far: The pitch was completely unsolicited and came through the Blog’s support address; it used ASD’s name (sixth word) to catch my attention; the subject line suggested I was being asked for “input,” as though the sender saw something fishy on the Internet and wanted to get my take on it; and the pitch proved to be for MPB Today, not an entity called “UniqueBuyingClub.”

Let’s proceed. It gets worse.

The first affiliate link appeared 12 words into the pitch, meaning I wasn’t really being solicited for input — unless it was input after the fact — because the sender already had registered for MPB Today. (Note: I checked the email address of the sender against the affiliate email addresses on the MPBToday page. They matched, meaning it is highly likely that the sender was an affiliate who was spamming me.)

There was no way to unsubscribe from the “list” I now found myself on. (BTW, I’m wondering if the sender knows if Warren Buffet and Donald Trump really have endorsed MPB Today, a business that bizarrely mixes the home delivery of groceries with a 2×2 cycler.  Their pictures are right at the top of the sales page, which implies an endorsement. Perhaps MPB Today missed the news about the FTC action last week in a case that alleges an Internet Marketing company that hawks Acai berry products tried to make people believe Oprah and Rachel Ray were on board.)

But it got worse from there. Not only was the “UniqueBuyingClub” angle confusing, the link asked me to visit a site called WeCreateRiches. Then, a second link asked me to visit the MPB Today site. We are only 14 words into the pitch at this point.

Let’s take another brief pause. The import of what’s happening here is that a former ASD member who perhaps got bilked in a $100 million MLM and securities scheme that promised riches now is urging me to visit a website called WeCreateRiches to sign up for a company that uses a home-delivered groceries business to promote an MLM scheme that uses a 2×2 matrix cycler. The U.S. Secret Service, which is investigating ASD, also has experience investigating cyclers.

Prior to receiving the email, I knew about MPB Today, which Rod Cook had written about. I just haven’t gotten around to writing about it yet, mostly because there is only so much time in the day. In some ways, I almost hate to write about it because writing about it potentially means that the MLM Stepfords will come of the woodwork to “defend” the company. It also potentially means the Blog will start getting spam from people angry that I dared mention the MPB Today name on a blog about scams. (Spam, in this context, means people who “defend” the company not by leaving a comment that actually defends the company, but by submitting their affiliate link on the theory that they might be able to cherry-pick a new downline member from the Blog’s readership ranks.)

In any event, the email went on to inform me that “Walmart is loving the results!!” generated by MPB Today.

Oh, really? I do hope the sender leaves a comment in this thread to substantiate the Walmart claim. It will spare me some work.

The email also wished me “Blessings and hope through your connections,” while urging me to “Please get back to me and let us help many ASD members who lost money and hope.”

Well, email sender, consider this post “getting back” to you.

It is my view that your email — and I haven’t gotten into the most revolting part yet — is “wretched, tawdry and cheap.” Like Judge Rosenbaum, I feel that way about Trevor Cook’s actions — as I do the actions of ASD’s Andy Bowdoin, who also traded on religion.

Take your “blessings” and “hope” elsewhere. I think the idea of using religion and identifying yourself as an ASD member to pitch other ASD members on MPB Today is “wretched, tawdry and cheap.”

Meanwhile, I think that sending a reporter who covers fraud schemes an email titled “input on opportunity” also is “wretched, tawdry and cheap.”

It makes me believe you’d sell anything for a commission and say anything to gain a commission. My thoughts on this subject were further reinforced this morning when I learned you sent a largely identical email to another forum.

“Blessings,” the email to the other forum concluded.

It made me want to retch. Is this what you believe Internet Marketing to be?

OK. Here’s the part of the pitch that irked me most (emphasis added):

“Just go online and order. BUT if you introduce club to just TWO and help those two introduce to two that completes ONE cycle for you. YOU – plus those six, Only qualification to be part of this is to introduce to TWO , but you may choose to get crazy and promote to many to inc. cycling. When you finish cycle one – go to backoffice and order grocery.goods BUT now company pays all shipping OR replace that voucher for a $200 WalmartGiftCard to go into the store and PLUS company sends you a $300 check to spend whereever. You NEVER add another dime. You may cycle as often as you please. People here in Orlando are cycling two to seven times in a week. There is so much excitment because people are hurting and now they can go get FREE groceries/goods and FREE gas at SamClub.”

Yep. Florida. Again.

Florida was ASD’s home. Florida means retirees — and ASD members again are being targeted in pitches to send money to MPB Today, whose headquarters also happens to be in Florida.

Here is who runs MPB Today.

And here’s hoping that no ASD member will submit to the email pitch of the affiliate who contacted the PP Blog and another forum that covers ASD-related issues.

“Blessings,” the emailer wrote — in pitches to both places — while also claiming her “girlfriend did [a] background check” and that “all is good” in the land of 2×2 cyclers targeted at victims of previous fraud schemes and prospects from a state favored by retirees who saved to get there.

Florida has one of the highest foreclosure rates in the United States. Just three seconds — three seconds — into the video pitch for MPB Today, the word “Foreclosure” appears on the screen. It appears again at the 11-second mark.

In MPB Today’s world, the apparent remedy for the foreclosure problem is to get Florida seniors and other struggling residents to join a 2×2 cycler.

“Wretched, tawdry and cheap” — for sure.

About the Author

47 Responses to “WRETCHED, TAWDRY AND CHEAP: AdSurfDaily Members Now Targeted In Pitches For An MLM 2X2 Cycler — One That Trades On Walmart’s Name While Affiliate Offers ‘Blessings’”

  1. Patrick,

    I doubt if it is an ASD victim promoting the scam. More likely, it is one of the ASD cheerleaders. Why not publish the name of the potential serial criminal who sent you the email? Their actions now (and when and if they prmoted the ASD Ponzi) are more than just wretched, they are criminal……

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  2. Are you sure it’s “MPD Today” – could that be a misprint somewhere? Or perhaps it’s another “company” run by the same person.

    The BBB report linked to above lead me to this thread at a well known ponzi promotion site:
    http://www.asamonitor.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=19337&st=40
    There it is listed as “MPBToday”. It should not surprise anyone that Ken Russo thinks this is an excellent “program”. (It’s not a program, it’s an obvious ponzi scheme).

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  3. Are you sure it’s “MPD Today” – could that be a misprint somewhere? Or perhaps it’s another “company” run by the same person.

    Actually, it’s MPB Today — a “B” as opposed to a”D”. My mistake. I fixed the typos above and will take another look to make sure I got them all.

    Thanks.

    Patrick

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  4. Why not publish the name of the potential serial criminal who sent you the email?

    The purported first name is “Rose.” I may publish the last name as information develops.

    Patrick

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  5. Are you sure it’s “MPD Today” – could that be a misprint somewhere? Or perhaps it’s another “company” run by the same person.The BBB report linked to above lead me to this thread at a well known ponzi promotion site:
    http://www.asamonitor.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=19337&st=40
    There it is listed as “MPBToday”. It should not surprise anyone that Ken Russo thinks this is an excellent “program”. (It’s not a program, it’s an obvious ponzi scheme).  

    Speaking of Russo, he’s now going to be conducting workshops in ChiTown in September on Home Based Businesses and introduce people to this “fabulous” program. His words, not mine.

    I know the area of the city in which he lives and am very familiar with it. Used to have some friends that lived there.

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  6. Mr Russo is either on a roll, desperate or thinks he can operate with complete impunity.

    Not only is he promoting MPD he’s also out there promoting his “next big thing” unde another one of his pseudonyms “DrDave”

    In the good Mr Russos’ own words:

    “A new program has just launched which I believe will be very well received. It addresses
    all of the problems and negative issues that have plagued other programs.

    The name of the program is 1X2PHP and the founders are Mark Ducker and Tom Walls.
    It is important to note that there is no reason or incentive for me or anyone else to personally
    sponsor more than 2 members. This is a company-wide team build which means that everyone
    who joins will be automatically included in the team build, regardless of whose link they use to
    join.

    1X2PHP is a part of the MTE Enterprises network of sites and we are located out of the
    United States. We have been in business online since 2006 and run several successful
    advertising and affiliate programs and have 1000s of members.

    We have built this program based on the gifting model, but have improved upon it.

    The big problem with gifting programs is people not doing what they need to do like
    sending in payments or recruiting others. This causes most of these programs to stall out”

    Is it any wonder so many naive people fall for these things when fraudsters such as Russo so flagrantly thumb their noses at the authorities ???

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  7. The name of the program is 1X2PHP and the founders are Mark Ducker and Tom Walls.

    scam.com thread from 2009 about these two:
    http://srv349.rackco.com/showthread.php?p=849181&styleid=%5Bb%5D2%5B/b%5D&styleid=%5Bb%5D2%5B/b%5D

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  8. It’s an illegal pyramid scheme as there are no products to sell retail as required by law for a MLM program. I have spoken with Rod Cook and he told me this will fold soon if not shut down by the authorities as being a scam. He also said a 2×2 matrix is the kiss of death in the MLM world. Rod is a big MLM supporter and believer, and for him to say this says it all. He’s not the only one. There are others in the MLM world who all say this is an illegal pyramid scheme and going nowhwere.

    It won’t be long until they cannot continue to get enough people to join this and it will implode on its own, if the FTC doesn’t act first. Of course this is what happens to all of Ken Russo’s “this is the best program I have seen in a long time” BS.

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  9. It may just be a rumor but I heard that the Florida Legislature is thinking of changing our name from the “Sunshine State” to “The Ponzi Capital of The World”.

    Come to Florida on Vacation…Leave on Probation!

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  10. It may just be a rumor but I heard that the Florida Legislature is thinking of changing our name from the “Sunshine State” to “The Ponzi Capital of The World”.

    A collapsed scheme in the nation of Benin is leading to calls for the prosecution of the country’s President.

    Every time I read about one of these schemes, I reflect on some of the bizarre developments in the ASD case, particularly the calls to have the prosecutors investigated, not Bowdoin.

    While Madoff was being vilified, Bowdoin was being lionized — in some ways, even canonized.

    There has been civil unrest in Albania, Columbia and other nations as a direct result of Ponzi/pyramid schemes. Benin is the latest.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/19/world/africa/19benin.html?src=me

    Patrick

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  11. you’re almost as bad as Rod- i understand that you’re probably stretched pretty thin what with all the responsibilities of protecting untold… whatever- you probably need to slow your roll and get your facts straight before you start spouting your uninformed BS to… Well, actually i guess it doesn’t matter, you’re meeting 99% of your readers expectations- in that people looking for success don’t frequent places like this.

    MPB offers participants the opportunity to save a substantial amount of time and aggravation by allowing them to buy that same can of beans,that same bag of macaroni that they would buy at the grocery store online. i feel good about the product- it’s home delivered groceries, what’s so sinister about that? At the very least every single participant no matter what can order their groceries online- check out the website and look at the prices… there’s no “autoship”. As far as the pay plan? I hate binary. I didn’t vote for Obama becasue i hate welfare and that’s my opinion of matrixes. My dislike doesn’t make them illegal. i don’t really like 2×2’s either- but i’ve found if we work hard we can make it happen. It would take 500 people to pay $500 in a $1 a spot matrix- talk about difficult… only the really good or the really lucky see this kind of success there…\

    This is only an interesting promotion- help MPB rock and they’ll pay you- in the meantime you can at least eat your product, right?

    i am so tired of fear-mongers like you.
    Good day.
    Glenn

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  12. you’re almost as bad as Rod- i understand that you’re probably stretched pretty thin what with all the responsibilities of protecting untold… whatever- you probably need to slow your roll and get your facts straight before you start spouting your uninformed BS to…

    Glenn,

    Do you have any comment on the propriety of using religion to pitch an offer for MPB Today to victims of a $100 million Ponzi scheme — a scheme in which religion was used to fleece the masses?

    Any comment on spamming the offer for MPB Today to a reporter and a forum that covers events important to the victims of a $100 million Ponzi scheme and positioning it as “input?”

    Any comment on not including an unsubscribe link in the email, which was designed to generate business for MPB Today?

    Any comment on the foreboding drum cadence in the MPB Today video and the use of the word “Foreclosure” to sell a grocery business and 2×2 matrix to the victims of a $100 million Ponzi scheme, some of whom remortgaged their homes to plow money into the scheme?

    Any comment on the Secret Service investigation into the Regenesis 2×2 matrix, which sold “commission centers?”

    How about the FTC case about the fake testimonials from Oprah and Rachel Ray? Do you think it’s a good idea for MPB Today to be using images of Warren Buffet and Donald Trump right at the top of the landing page?

    How about the claim from the MPB affiliate who was pitching ASD members? Do you think she’ll be able to demonstrate that “Walmart is loving the results!!” and that Orlando-area members are “cycling two to seven times in a week?”

    people looking for success don’t frequent places like this.

    That must be why I get so much mail from Ponzi scheme victims. They must not want the government to succeed in its efforts to recover money from scheme after scheme after scheme.

    And they must not want efforts to inform and educate the public on fraud schemes to succeed.

    That’s only if your theory is correct, of course.

    Patrick

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  13. in that people looking for success don’t frequent places like this.

    Err,

    would that be “success at any price” ????

    By your definition, is Andy Bowdoin a “success” because he made millions and is only “not a success” because was caught before he could “successfully” escape ???

    Perhaps you meant to say “people looking for success at making money at the expense of others don’t frequent places like this”

    Maybe “Glenn” is part of the Gordon Gekko generation where “greed is good” goes hand in hand with “success is good” and “success” trumps “honesty” or “ethics” or “morals” or “integrity”

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  14. Well, Patrick- since you asked… well then, i don’t feel near as bad Telling you then.

    What then, is this “article”? A diatribe against someone who had the nerve to “spam” you(can a “reporter really be “spammed” and why would he not want to be??). Patrick, i, personally, dabble in marketing online. That’s just to kind of begin to establish some bona-fides here. The way i figure it, Patrick, if I don’t get spammed 20 times a day… I’m not doing my job. Trust me, when you’re in this kind of business- yours and mine both- there is Nothing worse than being ignored. My advice, cool it on the getting spammed bit- it hurts your credibility.

    About your credibility… what’s the deal with jumping on your soapbox here crying about a $100 million alleged Ponzi scheme? Patrick, if it hadn’t been for your attempts to capitalize off the misfortune of 50,000 people losing- then you, my friend, wouldn’t be here at all. ASD is the soapbox that you climbed on to set yourself up as some kind of “expert”, some kind of “reliable source” to the misguided people that listen to your BS.

    As far as the unsubscribe link, well, would you have clicked it? If you would have, what kind of “reporter” are you? And if you wouldn’t have, then you’re just using it to incite the frenzy- shame on you: Again, your credibility suffers.

    I do not personally condone religion for anything other than (hopefully) getting me past the Pearly Gates. I do, however, see nothing wrong with establishing that you are religious and what brand you subscribe to- kind of like establishing a common ground. Many marketers make the mistake of using that common ground to build.

    There’s a lot i can see wrong with the persons marketing plan that brought MPB to your attention. As a matter of fact, i’m thinking they didn’t have much of a plan at all- my point is that we need to separate the messenger from the message here and focus on one or the other.

    The foreboding drum cadence? Patrick, at this point I’m confused- are you branching off to become a music critic now, also? A marketing critic? What would you suggest, “Yellow Brick Road”? The use of the word Foreclosure? Come now, Patrick, surely you jest. It’s marketing. I’m not thrilled about it either, I like to go at things from a more positive perspective.

    I don’t know enough about Regenesis- all I can say is that they probably were not promoting an online grocery delivery service- but then you knew that already, right? What sets MPB apart is that the product is really really real. Really. I can have my grocery order shipped to you if you need them.

    Fake testimonials from Oprah and Rachael? Personally, I’m staying as far away from ANYTHING they endorse as I can possibly get. If Oprah was endorsing Cash I’d trade mine in and get rid of it. Buffet and Trump? I don’t like it but there is nothing patently illegal about it- and there shouldn’t be, either.

    Demonstrate that Walmart is loving the results? Well, do you think they’re Hating them?

    Cycling two to seven times a week? That’s a pretty big spread and Orlando is a pretty big place… wouldn’t doubt it. Whether they can do it consistently… that’s a pretty tough row to hoe. I can demonstrate that I personally have cycled at least 2 times in one week.

    “That must be why I get so much mail from Ponzi scheme victims. They must not want the government to succeed in its efforts to recover money from scheme after scheme after scheme.”

    Is THAT the line of BS you’re using to lure people to read this drivel? Can you personally demonstrate that the US government has at any time ever returned anything other than pennies on the dollar? Wait a second, i apologize- you didn’t say anything about returning the money, did you?

    “And they must not want efforts to inform and educate the public on fraud schemes to succeed.”

    Informing is not so hard. Educating someone else implies that you at least know what you’re talking about.

    Rumours and speculation are not difficult to pass along.

    Glenn

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  15. in that people looking for success don’t frequent places like this.
    You’re here so apparently YOU are unsuccessful by your very own definition….why should anyone listen to you when you try to pitch them on this scam?

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  16. Glenn,

    In my view, Rose’s pitch is reprehensible and predatory — what with targeting ASD members and all.

    I don’t know if you were in ASD, but you’re “defending” MPB Today rather like some of the ASD members defended ASD. You appear to be emerging as a combative affiliate of MPB Today’s 2×2 matrix tied to a home grocery-delivery business — one that has Rose on the team and one that also has the support of the Ponzi and cash-gifting enthusiasts over at ASAMonitor.

    One of the MPB Today enthusiasts over at ASA Monitor noted today that he has “just signed up a minister who is going to use this as a fund raising method to help his church… should be interesting.”

    Here’s hoping that no former ASD member or AdViewGlobal member or Pathway to Prosperity member or Alpha Trade Group member or TIRN member or OLINT member or Legisi member who joins MPB Today uses proceeds they “earned” in any autosurf/HYIP to join the MPB Today opportunity.

    Hey, you know that the federal prosecutors in Orlando have four or five ongoing fraud prosecutions in which they’ve reverse-engineered and traced money from multiple schemes, right?

    I’m wondering: Do you think any of the illegal proceeds from ASD and other autosurf/HYIP schemes could have made their way into MPB Today — what with ASD members being targeted and all and with ASD members continuing to promote scheme after scheme after scheme?

    Glenn, did you see the FINRA warning?

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/07/15/go-finra-regulator-tackles-online-hyips-issues-warning-on-social-media-linked-ponzi-schemes-references-p2p-genius-funds-con-artists-and-bizarre-substratum-of-internet/

    How about the references to Ponzi forums in the Pathway to Prosperity case?

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/05/31/kaboom-affidavit-in-pathway-to-prosperity-case-paints-picture-of-wanton-criminality-complaint-references-talkgold-asamonitor-moneymakergroup-posts-united-states-throws-down-gauntlet/

    It’s still pretty early in MPB Today’s life. Even so, it’s normally bad news when a company’s name gets pitched from ASAMonitor and the other Ponzi forums. Some of the promoters over there are seeking both noobs and players — and they can drag plenty of dirty money into a company quickly.

    Demonstrate that Walmart is loving the results? Well, do you think they’re Hating them?

    Actually, yes. I do.

    Walmart is having its brand tied to a 2×2 cycler matrix, which is being promoted at ASAMonitor. Rose, of course, chose to target ASD members and email a reporter about what she was doing.

    I think there is zero chance that Walmart is pleased — but I’m going to call next week to see if Walmart has any comment.

    The foreboding drum cadence? Patrick, at this point I’m confused- are you branching off to become a music critic now, also? A marketing critic? What would you suggest, “Yellow Brick Road”? The use of the word Foreclosure? Come now, Patrick, surely you jest. It’s marketing. I’m not thrilled about it either, I like to go at things from a more positive perspective.

    Actually, I did criticize the “music” BizAdSplash used. I called the sound from the drum a “dire bang.”

    BizAdSplash also used the word “foreclosure” in its video pitch.

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/03/15/death-cycle-for-bizadsplash-complete-site-resolves-to-blank-page-on-u-s-server-members-losses-unclear/

    I don’t know how much money folks lost in BizAdSplash. But I do know that lots of them were ASD members. Did you know that Clarence Busby, the operator of Golden Panda Ad Builder and the purported “chief consultant” and owner of BizAdSplash, which debuted after the ASD and Golden Panda seizures, used the abbreviation “Rev.” at least 120 times in a court filing involving Golden Panda last year?

    If you’d like to see the BizAdSplash pitch, look here:

    http://www.youtube.com/user/BizAdSplash

    Patrick

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  17. As a long time reader and follower of the PP Blog I was rather intrigued by this article by Patrick.

    I am not a member of MPB Today and do not intend to be.

    I do, of course, have mountains of respect for the work done by this blog to uncover the facts behind scams and to educate the public as a way of protecting them from what otherwise might seem like legitimate opportunities.

    So, that being said…….

    I’m not sure that I see where the actual company, MPB Today is illegal or unethical.

    I know that Rod Cook doesn’t like 2×2’s but that’s his opinion. 2×2’s, in general, are not illegal as long as sales requirements are in place to qualify for commissions and rewards.

    The question that I do have relates to the purchase fee at MPB Today. When one buys in at MPB is there a concrete, quantifiable product or service that is actually provided.

    Or, perhaps, is it just that the purchase has the right to earn.

    I’d be keenly interested to know what the actual product is at MPB and if the readers here have actually used that product to satisfaction.

    If the product does exist, has value close to the purchase price, then this discussion would seem to more about sales tactics and pushing various marketing envelopes than the underlying structure of the company in question.

    Again, to repeat, I am not a member of MPB and have no plans to become a member.

    I’m just taking a Random Walk in the middle of this discussion.

    Thanks for letting me ramble.

    ARWR

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  18. OK Glenn, I will bite. I don’ want to join MPBToday, but I do want to buy groceries from you. I can buy groceries from you without having to join MPBToday, right?

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  19. As a long time reader and follower of the PP Blog I was rather intrigued by this article by Patrick.I am not a member of MPB Today and do not intend to be.I do, ofcourse, have mountains of respect for the work done by this blog to uncover the facts behind scams and to educate the public as a way of protecting them from what otherwise might seem like legitimate opportunities.So, that being said…….I’m not sure that I see where the actual company, MPB Today is illegal or unethical.I know that Rod Cook doesn’t like 2×2′s but that’s his opinion. 2×2′s, in general, are not illegal as long as sales requirements are in place to qualify for commissions and rewards.The question that I do have relates to the purchase fee at MPB Today. When one buys in at MPB is there a concrete, quantifiable product or service that is actually provided.Or, perhaps, is it just that the purchase has the right to earn.I’d be keenly interested to know what the actual product is at MPB and if the readers here have actually used that product to satisfaction.If the product does exist, has value close to the purchase price, then this discussion would seem to more about sales tactics and pushing various marketing envelopes than the underlying structure of the company in question.Again, to repeat, I am not a member of MPB and have no plans to become a member.I’m just taking a Random Walk in the middle of this discussion.Thanks for letting me ramble.ARWR  

    Several points arise from your post, ARWR,
    1) Do you understand fully how a “2 X 2 matrix” works ???
    i.e. if you draw the structure on paper, how many people can actually make money, and how many people are required to keep the “matrix” going ???
    Forget about the “YOU only have to find 6 people”
    If “EVERYONE” is the “YOU” then each person needs to find 6 people to qualify to make “real” money.
    When doing your diagram, see how many “only find 6” members do you think it will take to cover the whole 320+ million residents of the USA

    2) Your interpretation of the FTC rulings is slightly off skew.
    The problem is not that there is no “quantifiable product or service” The problem is that it is entirely possible for people to earn most, if not all, of their money by recruitment alone

    IOW, if a greater proportion of total earnings can be made with little or no sales of “product” then a business is looking down the barrel, so to speak.

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  20. There’s so much mis-information here that it is basically impossible to address it all. There are a few key points I’d like to address, though.

    ” I don’t know if you were in ASD, but you’re “defending” MPB Today rather like some of the ASD members defended ASD. You appear to be emerging as a combative affiliate of MPB Today’s 2×2 matrix tied to a home grocery-delivery business — one that has Rose on the team and one that also has the support of the Ponzi and cash-gifting enthusiasts over at ASAMonitor.”

    Mr. Pretty, I am a “defending MPB” and am a “combative affiliate”? No more than you’re an “offensive blogger.” I’m just trying to set the record straight, get past all the hype and mis-information.

    ““people looking for success at making money at the expense of others don’t frequent places like this””

    Littlerounderfeller- it’s just that i’ve read this entire blog site and have yet to find anything that refers to success.

    “In my view, Rose’s pitch is reprehensible and predatory — what with targeting ASD members and all.”

    You ARE kidding me, right? Targeting ASD? There’s quite a few folks involved in MPB right now, 99% of which have probably never heard of ASD. Preditory? We travel in the same circles, those of us looking for opportunity on the internet. Contrary to popular belief, the majority of ASD members did not go mortgage their homes, sign notes with loan sharks or hock their first-born to join ASD. As Mark Twain said (i think it was Twain) “You can’t cheat an honest man.” I don’t buy into all that “it wasn’t my fault” crap- there’s such a thing as Personal Responsibility- I went into ASD with my eyes wide open, I accept that responsibility- I don’t need to be coddled and protected or treated with kidd gloves like some traumatized survivor. There are lots of worse things that happen to lots of better people. Preditory implies that i am working with some sort of disablity and i resent that, as would most members of ASD.

    The music most of these marketing folks use is in the public domain or from companies that charge a nominal fee for use. It’s generic- and there’s not much of a selection. The BizAdSplash theme song was common to a couple of other programs.

    “Hey, you know that the federal prosecutors in Orlando have four or five ongoing fraud prosecutions in which they’ve reverse-engineered and traced money from multiple schemes, right?

    I’m wondering: Do you think any of the illegal proceeds from ASD and other autosurf/HYIP schemes could have made their way into MPB Today — what with ASD members being targeted and all and with ASD members continuing to promote scheme after scheme after scheme?”

    hey, if “Federal Prosecutors” in Orlando have that much time on their hands I’m calling my congressman and we’re going to have a long talk about where my tax money is going and how it’s spent- seriously. i am not in the business of working my ass off to pay my taxes to supplement some forensic accountants college loan. Period. We might see if they’re going to order a seizure of Walmart while we’re at it, that’s where 99% of the money ended up. it’s fear-monger tactics like this that i can’t tolerate.

    “I think there is zero chance that Walmart is pleased — but I’m going to call next week to see if Walmart has any comment.”

    MPB has payed about $900,000 in commissions over the past 3 weeks. They buy WM gift cards in bulk. They are not unlike any other corporation in the world that offers gift cards to their employees.

    ” I do, of course, have mountains of respect for the work done by this blog to uncover the facts behind scams and to educate the public as a way of protecting them from what otherwise might seem like legitimate opportunities.”

    As a new reader of this blog i’m not sure i share your excitement- i can absolutely guarantee that Patrick here did ZERO research into MPB before he posted his article condemning it.

    “The question that I do have relates to the purchase fee at MPB Today. When one buys in at MPB is there a concrete, quantifiable product or service that is actually provided.”

    Groceries. Specifically groceries delivered to your front door. Go to the site, join the company- for $210 dollars you are actually buying $200 worth of groceries ($10 fee for the website back office). They will be delivered to your home a few days after you place your order. The prices are competitive with grocery prices in your home town- unless you live in NYC and then it’s my understanding that you’re going to be Really happy.

    “Several points arise from your post, ARWR,
    1) Do you understand fully how a “2 X 2 matrix” works ???
    i.e. if you draw the structure on paper, how many people can actually make money, and how many people are required to keep the “matrix” going ???
    Forget about the “YOU only have to find 6 people”
    If “EVERYONE” is the “YOU” then each person needs to find 6 people to qualify to make “real” money.
    When doing your diagram, see how many “only find 6″ members do you think it will take to cover the whole 320+ million residents of the USA

    2) Your interpretation of the FTC rulings is slightly off skew.
    The problem is not that there is no “quantifiable product or service” The problem is that it is entirely possible for people to earn most, if not all, of their money by recruitment alone

    IOW, if a greater proportion of total earnings can be made with little or no sales of “product” then a business is looking down the barrel, so to speak.”

    There are several issues with the above quote- so many i don’t even know where to begin.

    Littleroundman is working from a perspective of earning a million dollars, or something. This isn’t that kind of program, it’s just not going to happen for you tommorrow or next week or next month or even next year. it will probably Never happen. So, let’s forget about that and find out what you Can earn in a reasonable amount of time.
    “Do you understand fully how a “2 X 2 matrix” works ???
    i.e. if you draw the structure on paper, how many people can actually make money, and how many people are required to keep the “matrix” going ???
    Forget about the “YOU only have to find 6 people”

    Actually, all you’ve got to do is find 6 people. I promise. Or find 2 who find 2. It’s that simple. You get paid $300 in cash + if you haven’t already ordered your groceries from the site then you can opt to exchange your grocery order for a Walmart card and go shopping locally. if you Don’t find 6 people- because you can’t or because you don’t want to or whatever, you can always just elect to order groceries from the site- they’ve got some fair prices and you won’t have to get out and catch the flu at Wally world. BTW- if you find 6 or 2 who find 2 and elect to order groceries at That point then MPB pays the shipping, free.

    After you find 6, or 2 who find 2, or some combination… and after you get paid… then MPB GIVES you another $200 pre-paid grocery card, free of charge. You can IMMEDIATELY order groceries from the site or you can wait, find 6, or 2 who find 2, or some combination- and elect for the Walmart card again or order groceries and MPB will pay the shipping… and they GIVE yopu ANOTHER pre-paid grocery card and the cycle starts again…

    I don’t know if this qualifies as your definition of “real” money or not- you’re getting $300 in cash (check) + free shipping on your groceries or, if you elect, a Walmart card worth $200… plus an additional $200 pre-paid grocery card, free. Basically $500 + a free pre-paid card…

    i think that no matter what the hype tells us, most people work network companies for months before they see a $500 profit.

    “When doing your diagram, see how many “only find 6″ members do you think it will take to cover the whole 320+ million residents of the USA”

    Man, you are ambitious, I’ll give you that! I’ve been doing MPB for 2 months now, made money, never once worried about my organization getting close to the 320 million. I figure by that time they’ll need to reorder groceries anyway.

    “OK Glenn, I will bite. I don’ want to join MPBToday, but I do want to buy groceries from you. I can buy groceries from you without having to join MPBToday, right?”

    Yes, you can. I’ll put a link to my facebook under my website, if that’s allowed.

    I’m tired of writing, sorry if i didn’t get to your question, comment, or statement- maybe next time.

    Any questions? (man have i set myself up to get slammed here or what?? lol).

      (Quote)

  21. Man, you are ambitious, I’ll give you that! I’ve been doing MPB for 2 months now, made money, never once worried about my organization getting close to the 320 million. I figure by that time they’ll need to reorder groceries anyway.

    Ah, now I gotcha,

    you’re one of those “screw you, Jack, I’m alright” kinda fellas.

    That explains everything.

    Here was I describing why a “2 X 2 matrix” is both illogical and illegal, and you’ve turned it into “as long as I make money, why would I care about anyone else” things.

    As long as we’re clear on where you stand.

    Never fear, as long as MPD doesn’t recruit more than a handful of new members, YOU at least, will be OK.

    You and your wide open eyes can then simply move on to the next opportunity.

      (Quote)

  22. hey, if “Federal Prosecutors” in Orlando have that much time on their hands I’m calling my congressman and we’re going to have a long talk about where my tax money is going and how it’s spent- seriously. i am not in the business of working my ass off to pay my taxes to supplement some forensic accountants college loan. Period. We might see if they’re going to order a seizure of Walmart while we’re at it, that’s where 99% of the money ended up. it’s fear-monger tactics like this that i can’t tolerate.

    Glenn,

    This surfaces in scheme after scheme — attacks on prosecutors and court-appointed receivers. It’s one of the things the scammers teach over at ASAMonitor, TalkGold, MoneyMakerGroup and other Ponzi sites.

    Rope people into the Ponzi. When it gets taken down, attack the prosecutors and the receivers. Deflect. Deflect. Deflect.

    On a side note, one of the things the money-laundering statutes are designed to guard against is banks, utility companies, supermarkets and businesses of all sorts — from Walmart to the streetside hotdog vendor — coming into possession of dirty money.

    Here is a description of some Andy Bowdoin family transactions from the summer of 2008 that used ASD funds, according to prosecutors.

    * June 10, 2008: Edna Faye Bowdoin and her son, George Harris, opened an account at Capital City Bank, funding it with $177,900 transferred from ASD’s Bank of America accounts. Harris later used $157,216 of the deposit to pay off the Tallahassee home he shared with his wife, Judy Harris.
    * June 11, 2008: Judy Harris and George Harris used $28,607 to purchase a 2008 Honda CRV. The vehicle was paid for with ASD company check No. 1337. On Aug. 8 — about a week after ASD’s assets were seized in the initial complaint — a lien was placed on the vehicle to secure a $5,000 loan Judy Harris took out with a family member.
    * June 11, 2008: ASD Chief Executive Officer Juan Fernandez issued an ASD check for $33,450 that was used to pay for a 2009 Acura registered to Hays McDougal Amos.
    * June 28, 2008: ASD Check No. 2708, for $20,506, was used to purchase jet skis and a trailer. The bill of sale was made out to ASD, and Edna Faye Bowdoin signed for the goods.
    * July 1, 2008: A check from Bowdoin/Harris Enterprises for $23,445 was used to purchase a Triton boat and other equipment. The funds Bowdoin/Harris used originated in ASD’s Bank of America accounts.
    * July 28, 2008: A cashier’s check from Bowdoin/Harris for $48,244 was used to pay for a Lincoln. The funds originated in ASD’s accounts.

    If you walk it back, Glenn, you can plainly see that money the Feds say was tainted affected commerce at multiple points — everything from a bank to car dealers and boat dealers and a private lender in a family transaction.

    Good luck trying to persuade your Congressman that your tax dollars are going to waste as the Feds reverse-engineer scams to keep the money supply safe from people who would poison it and thus pollute the commerce stream at multiple points.

    I don’t buy into all that “it wasn’t my fault” crap- there’s such a thing as Personal Responsibility- I went into ASD with my eyes wide open, I accept that responsibility

    If you “accept that responsibility,” why would you even bother trying to chat up your Congressman and see if he’ll hammer prosecutors and court-appointed receivers who are investigating Ponzi schemes?

    Here’s a story you might want to share with your Congressman. It was written by a widow:

    http://patrickpretty.com/2009/11/13/widow-shares-story-of-20000-loss-in-adsurfdaily/

    Here is another one. It is based on an interview with a woman who is deaf:

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/01/04/deaf-woman-64-says-she-lost-5300-in-noobing-autosurf-and-cant-sleep-at-night-contacts-fbi-and-sheriffs-office-for-help/

    it’s just that i’ve read this entire blog site and have yet to find anything that refers to success.

    This is not an MLM or Internet Marketing cheerleading Blog, Glen. It’s a crime Blog. There are plenty of stories about “success” — successful interventions by law enforcement and successful prosecutions in fraud schemes, for instance.

    There also is plenty of important information for marketers — the type of information they can use to avoid pitfalls and recognize scams.

    They are not unlike any other corporation in the world that offers gift cards to their employees.

    Yes, they are. They are operating a 2×2 matrix cycler. Some of their affiliates are sayings things such as “Walmart is loving the results!!”

    Walmart works hard to create an appealing image and brand. There is nothing appealing about having your brand name marketed from the ASAMonitor forum, a Ponzi cesspit. That’s what MPB affiliates are doing — while some of them also tie the offer to religion and target members of ASD, for example.

    i can absolutely guarantee that Patrick here did ZERO research into MPB before he posted his article condemning it.

    No, you can’t — no more than an MPB affiliate can speak for Walmart and plant the seed that the company is thrilled.

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  23. Glenn Stoner appears to be quite familiar with both ASD and BizAdSplash – he is linked to both via facebook:
    http://www.facebook.com/posted.php?id=27041151833
    http://www.facebook.com/posted.php?id=53547420027

    At the very least he is promoting something called “GoodleAdz”

    best online advertising, mlm,traffic exchanges, traffic builders, banner advertising,autosurfs,investment programs.work from home, make money online, data entry, data entry jobs, business opportunity, part time work, online income, solidtrustpay, liberty reserve, alertpay, strictpay opportunities.

    His facebook page contains a link to http://www.cycle500.com which re-directs to http://www.mpbtoday.com. Glenn Stoner obviously has an interest in discrediting any unfavourable comments away from his latest pyramid scheme.

    He has a blog here:
    http://shine.yahoo.com/channel/none/multiple-streams-of-residual-income-557416/

    The Wall Mart and/or groceries are irrelevant and are just a distraction. All Glenn is interested in is creating “multiple streams of residual income” AKA pimping and playing any ponzi/pyramid scheme that might make him a bit of money. That’s if he can rope in a few suckers.

      (Quote)

  24. LRM,

    I think that you are missing Glenn’s point. His point apaprently is that it is OK to be a serial criminal like him (ASD, then BAS — per Tony’s post — and now this 2×2 scam) as long as he is only making a little bit of money illegally, not the big score……

    Ah, now I gotcha,you’re one of those “screw you, Jack, I’m alright” kinda fellas.That explains everything.Here was I describing why a “2 X 2 matrix” is both illogical and illegal, and you’ve turned it into “as long as I make money, why would I care about anyone else” things.As long as we’re clear on where you stand.Never fear, as long as MPD doesn’t recruit more than a handful of new members, YOU at least, will be OK.You and your wide open eyes can then simply move on to the next opportunity.  (Quote)

      (Quote)

  25. ARWR,

    I know previously you have read and understood the Black Box analysis on ASD. If you apply the same tool to this (or other 2×2’s) you will see that they can easily be shown to be mathematically unsustainable. In the simplest case, subtract out all of the breakeven stuff (the groceries), which every pyramid scheme tries to introduce in order to convolute the facts. Fortunately, the BBM gets rid of the convolutions. What is left after taking the groceries off of the table is a simple pyramid scheme where the earlier “investors” make money from the later “investors” and the odds of the later investors breaking even are far poorer than for the early entrants. Further, in reasonably short order, like all pyramids, eventually EVERYONE on the planet needs to sign up in order for the scheme to run its maximum course, which is less than 13 full cycles (6 to the thirteenth power). Illegal I am afraid……..

    As a long time reader and follower of the PP Blog I was rather intrigued by this article by Patrick.I am not a member of MPB Today and do not intend to be.I do, of course, have mountains of respect for the work done by this blog to uncover the facts behind scams and to educate the public as a way of protecting them from what otherwise might seem like legitimate opportunities.So, that being said…….I’m not sure that I see where the actual company, MPB Today is illegal or unethical.I know that Rod Cook doesn’t like 2×2′s but that’s his opinion. 2×2′s, in general, are not illegal as long as sales requirements are in place to qualify for commissions and rewards.The question that I do have relates to the purchase fee at MPB Today. When one buys in at MPB is there a concrete, quantifiable product or service that is actually provided.Or, perhaps, is it just that the purchase has the right to earn.I’d be keenly interested to know what the actual product is at MPB and if the readers here have actually used that product to satisfaction.If the product does exist, has value close to the purchase price, then this discussion would seem to more about sales tactics and pushing various marketing envelopes than the underlying structure of the company in question.Again, to repeat, I am not a member of MPB and have no plans to become a member.I’m just taking a Random Walk in the middle of this discussion.Thanks for letting me ramble.ARWR  (Quote)

      (Quote)

  26. “GoodleAdz”

    Site appears to resolve to Panama, home of AdViewGlobal.

    Quick notes:

    1.) Aug. 18, 2008: Domain name for AdGateWorld (AGW) registered.
    2.) Sept. 22, 2008: Domain name for AdViewGlobal (AVG) registered.
    3.) Nov. 7, 2008: Domain name for BizAdSplash (BAS) registered.
    4.) Nov. 18, 2008: Domain name for AdPayDaily (APD) registered.
    5.) Nov. 26, 2008: Domain name for GoodleAdz registered.

    So, three surfs in November 2008 alone — one of them whose name is only one letter off from spelling “Google.”

    The domain name for GoodleAdz was registered 7 days after the court ruling went against ASD on Nov. 19, 2008 — and one day before ASD gave Surf’s Up its official endorsement on Nov. 27, 2008.

    I’m wondering: Were these things originally contemplated as sort of Pac Men that would feed off each other? Some folks might have though that, “Hey, Bowdoin is scoring cash by the tens of millions. Maybe I can do the same.”

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  27. LRM,I think that you are missing Glenn’s point. His point apaprently is that it is OK to be a serial criminal like him (ASD, then BAS — per Tony’s post — and now this 2×2 scam) as long as he is only making a little bit of money illegally, not the big score(Quote)

    Seems we’ve heard that mantra before on this very blog from lil joe.

      (Quote)

  28. Entertained: Since When does belonging to a FACEBOOK GROUP constitute criminal activity? Cycle500 is my link, huh? lol. you can call the company, i am not an affiliate. i have friends that are affiliates- but i am not.

    And btw- MPB is a promotion arm of Southeatern Delivery- a home delivery grocery company. Take the groceries out of the equation? I know it’s little details like that that screw up all the hypotheticals- but hell, since when did we ever let little things like facts get in the way, right?

    Attack the prosecutors? Protect Walmart from dirty money? What i said was that it’s improbable and/or impossible to attempt to do what you imply they’re attempting to do in the vague vicinity of Orlando, or wherever- and therefore they are probably Not doing whatever it is that you’re vaguely implying they are attempting to do in the vicinity of Orlando, or wherever.

    GoodleAdz is one letter away from GoogleAdz? OMG! And it’s only TWO letters over on the keyboard to! And check it out.. it’s exactly 3 letters before the G in the alphabet! How screwy is that!? 1,2,3! That constitutes Proof doesn’t it!?? GoodleAdz came from the words “Good Leadz”. I advertise (free) there. i am not a paid member. I advertise free on any one of a half dozen sites, i am not a paid member of any of them. i own a number of websites. i am a firm believer in developing multiple streams of income. I own ebay stores and participated for a while in the eBay affiliate program. i also participated in the Sprint affiliate program, a referral program to build the customer base of a Texas ISP, a referral program for a home mortgage company, and one promoting my dry cleaners.

    illegal 2×2 cycler? i am not aware of a moratorium on 2×2 cyclers- have they been found illegal? in general or in particular? can you point me to the record?

    This is the thing i despise above all others- half truth and innuendo, the currency of fear mongers.

    Successful interventions of ponzi’s? Further research into the Golden Panda Ad Builder thing leads to a prime example of issues with the government system of investigation and intervention- Busby evidentially signed off on the Golden Panda issue years ago and one single penny has yet, to my knowledge, been returned to anyone; perhaps you should try reporting on that. As a matter of fact, maybe you should report on the pittance that most people receive after government intervention- that ‘s the real news story. As long as people think the kind and gracious big brother is gonna give back all their little old cash then folks don’t mind so much giving it away in hopes of making a good return before it gets shut down- cause guess what? They’re gonna get it back, right?

    Wrong. So maybe you should clue them in to what comes next…

    Good night and God Bless, even if i know how much you hate references to God (or simply because of it) ;-).

      (Quote)

  29. So, three surfs in November 2008 alone — one of them whose name is only one letter off from spelling “Google.”

    I think it was originally meant to read as “good-leadz” as in MLM downline building, but someone adapted it to sound like an ad-surf. It should not surprise anyone that this is being promoted on MMG, DreamTeamMoney and maybe talkgold.

    With GoodleAdz, you will soon be able to purchase “advertising credits” and earn back a substantial 130% return of the advertising you purchased!

    Sound familiar?
    At the very least, Glenn is a serial ponzi promoter and doesn’t just “dabble in marketing online”.

      (Quote)

  30. Looks like GoodleAdz was trying to start up in 2009.
    http://www.getacoder.com/projects/traffic%20exchange%20software_110615.html

    For a better understanding of this concept, please visit the websites of the following companies:

    http://www.adviewglobal.com/
    http://www.adgateworld.com/
    http://www.ad-ventures4u.com
    http://www.bizadsplash.com

    It obviously knows it’s targeted audience.

      (Quote)

  31. Take the groceries out of the equation? I know it’s little details like that that screw up all the hypotheticals- but hell, since when did we ever let little things like facts get in the way, right?

    Glenn,

    Entertained is a mathematician. He is describing the “Black Box” method one can apply to test the sustainability of “opportunities.”

    http://patrickpretty.com/2009/01/03/asd-sustainability-black-box-entertained/

    What i said was that it’s improbable and/or impossible to attempt to do what you imply they’re attempting to do in the vague vicinity of Orlando, or wherever- and therefore they are probably Not doing whatever it is that you’re vaguely implying they are attempting to do in the vicinity of Orlando, or wherever.

    You really haven’t spent much time at this Blog, have you Glenn? If you had, you would know the prosecutors in the Middle District of Florida, which includes Orlando, are involved in several ongoing HYIP investigations. They’ve tied some of the money to an international narcotics probe and seized bank accounts in Arizona, for instance.

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/05/16/kaboom-agents-tie-alleged-evolution-market-group-ponzi-and-hyip-fraud-scheme-to-narcotics-case-in-arizona-tens-of-millions-of-dollars-seized-firms-promoted-on-asa-monitor-talkgold-forums/

    Speaking of narcotics probes, the owner of the company that supplied debit cards to AdSurfDaily is wanted by Interpol.

    http://patrickpretty.com/2009/08/17/developing-story-firm-that-provided-adsurfdaily-debit-card-indicted-feds-say-virtual-money-inc-helped-colombian-drug-operation-launder-money-in-medellin/

    You’d also know — if you actually did read this Blog — that the Feds have come into possession of various databases. They know who the players are — and they also know that some of the participants have ties to tax-deniers.

    GoodleAdz is one letter away from GoogleAdz? OMG!

    Yes, “Goodle” is only one letter away from “Google.” Nice deflection, though.

    Successful interventions of ponzi’s? Further research into the Golden Panda Ad Builder thing leads to a prime example of issues with the government system of investigation and intervention- Busby evidentially signed off on the Golden Panda issue years ago and one single penny has yet, to my knowledge, been returned to anyone; perhaps you should try reporting on that.

    Yes, the ASD/Golden Panda case was a successful intervention. You must have read both the August 2008 and the Dec. 2008 complaints, right?

    And you must have read the racketeering lawsuit, right?

    You must know, of course, that both the forfeiture cases and the RICO case talk about a conspiracy, right? And you know that the Feds consider ASD/Golden Panda/La Fuente Dinero one in the same with respect to the forfeiture allegations, right?

    How about the grand jury proceedings. You know about them, right?

    And you also know that the Feds have a clean sweep so far in the forfeiture proceedings and that Bowdoin is appealing — and that those appeals have delayed the restitution program, right?

    But now you’re here trying to tell readers that the government hasn’t returned “one single penny” yet, when it is Andy Bowdoin who is responsible for the delays.

    As a matter of fact, maybe you should report on the pittance that most people receive after government intervention- that ‘s the real news story.

    It has been reported here many times. I thought you said you read this Blog.

    As long as people think the kind and gracious big brother is gonna give back all their little old cash then folks don’t mind so much giving it away in hopes of making a good return before it gets shut down- cause guess what? They’re gonna get it back, right?

    This is your rationale for playing the Ponzis? It makes no sense at all. Not a lick.

    Did you belong to Surf’s Up? It played the “Big Brother” card on one hand while it played the Thought Police with the other. Like your apparent defense for playing the Ponzis above, it made no sense at all.

    Good night and God Bless, even if i know how much you hate references to God (or simply because of it)

    So, now you’re going to try to plant the seed that I oppose God because I write about affinity fraud? You really haven’t spent much time here, have you?

    Ever hear of Bob Guenther? He thinks I’m one of those nasty Libs, and he declared “war” on this Blog — in between his various court appointments. One was for violating court orders. The other was when he was named a respondent in a racketeering lawsuit.

    You can look it up.

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  32. The ASD seizure date was Aug. 1, 2008. The raid occurred on Aug. 5, 2008.

    1.) Aug. 18, 2008: Domain name for AdGateWorld (AGW) registered.
    2.) Sept. 22, 2008: Domain name for AdViewGlobal (AVG) registered.
    3.) Nov. 7, 2008: Domain name for BizAdSplash (BAS) registered.
    4.) Nov. 18, 2008: Domain name for AdPayDaily (APD) registered.
    5.) Nov. 26, 2008: Domain name for GoodleAdz registered.

    @ Glenn,

    Based on the list above, I’m wondering if you see why some folks just might think other folks have the notion that ASD members are ripe targets for the fleecing.

    Did you know ASD’s name actually appeared on the Terms of Service page for AdGateWorld?

    http://patrickpretty.com/2009/01/31/asd-adgateworld-adviewglobal-in-pictures/

    @ Tony: The link you provided above — http://www.getacoder.com/projects/traffic%20exchange%20software_110615.html — reminds me of the early days of AdGateWorld, referred to in the link I provided Glenn.

    Patrick

      (Quote)

  33. Glenn

    As a matter of fact, maybe you should report on the pittance that most people receive after government intervention- that ‘s the real news story.

    Of course it is. That’s why ponzis are illegal. There is NEVER enough cash left to pay back the victims, before or after a government intervention. Most ponzis go bust BEFORE the government even get to them! Fortunately for the victims, if the government get there before the owners,insiders and early members have spent all the money, there is something left for the later members.

    Glenn, ponzis always take in less than they promise to pay out. Later members fund payments to earlier members. There is not sufficient outside income for it to be any other way. It simple math – whether or not one likes it – there is no way round it. That is why they are illegal.

    It is too easy to blame the government and, in the case of ponzis, a pretty cheap get out. They cant return what they dont have. The answer to your comment is very clear to most, but evidently not to you.

    This whole blog indirectly relates to the subject of WHY the government only returns peanuts on the dollar to the victims of people who run ponzi schemes.

      (Quote)

  34. Glenn: Since you say I can purchase groceries from you without having to be a member of MPBToday, how much is it going to cost me to have my groceries delivered to me in Southern California?

      (Quote)

  35. Calling Glenn, Calling Glenn. Where are you?

    I guess Glenn isn’t interested in me just buying groceries from him. No money in it I guess for him to make; or the cost for the gorceries would have made the total cost 5 times more than going to the grocery store. So much for a retail product to sell.

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  36. I wonder what this little snippet on the MPD website means, exactly:

    “The shipping & handling charges are appropriate to what you order and your location, and average from 25 – 50%. If you order lighter items – your cost is lower than if you order heavy items.”

    Average 25% to 50% of the total ????

    Are they kidding ????

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  37. Ok then.. just wanted to let you all know my hubby (totally) against my wishes has joined the new SCAM MPBToday.. what a joke!!! $210 to get a bunch of people to join and then you get like a $200 walmart gift card or some other bull. and the groceries holy catfish.. they are expensive and you pay between 25%-40% for shipping.. ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!! and as I use coupons and buy on sale and generic this would not by any stretch of the imagination be something I am interested in… yes we got screwed big time by ASD and a few others after that.. Seems my hubby believes all the bull his friends tell him. To me a few hundred dollars a pop for this stuff is a few hundred less dollars we have to survive on. Thanks for letting me vent.. Awe I feel much better now.. Check back later..
    Have a Great Day!!!

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  38. Brenda: just wanted to let you all know my hubby (totally) against my wishes has joined the new SCAM MPBToday.. what a joke!!! $210 to get a bunch of people to join and then you get like a $200 walmart gift card or some other bull. and the groceries holy catfish.. they are expensive and you pay between 25%-40% for shipping.. ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!

    Hello Brenda,

    Hope he didn’t sign up for WebsiteTester, whose launch is being delayed until 400,000 people register.

    On a side note, the pitch for MPB Today resembles the pitch for Biz Ad Splash — in that it used dire beats from a drum as the word “foreclosure” flashed on the screen.

    Here are two stories you may find of interest:

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/09/01/websitetester-biz-delays-launch-produces-video-with-voice-but-no-faces-sends-members-to-news-release-by-unnamed-author/

    http://patrickpretty.com/2010/09/01/kaboom-florida-again-ftc-hits-bogus-credit-repair-firm-with-14-million-judgment-alleged-schemers-lose-cars-real-estate-in-miami-dade-broward-counties/

    Patrick

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  39. Patrick:

    GREAT research on the GoodleAdz.

    It surely seemed to be “same song, second verse” of the ASD Ponzi model just using clicks rather than webviews.

    I’d be curious if anyone has taken a close look at that new Kooday that’s out. They talk about Revenue Share which is usually a good indicator of chicanery.

    ARWR

    admin:
    Site appears to resolve to Panama, home of AdViewGlobal.Quick notes:1.) Aug. 18, 2008: Domain namefor AdGateWorld (AGW) registered. 2.) Sept. 22, 2008: Domain name for AdViewGlobal (AVG) registered. 3.) Nov. 7, 2008: Domain name for BizAdSplash (BAS) registered. 4.) Nov. 18, 2008: Domain name for AdPayDaily (APD) registered. 5.) Nov. 26, 2008: Domain name for GoodleAdz registered.So, three surfs in November 2008 alone — one of them whose name is only one letter off from spelling “Google.”The domain name for GoodleAdz was registered 7 days after the court ruling went against ASD on Nov. 19, 2008 — and one day before ASD gave Surf’s Up its official endorsement on Nov. 27, 2008.I’m wondering: Were these things originally contemplated as sort of Pac Men that would feed off each other? Some folks might have though that, “Hey, Bowdoin is scoring cash by the tens of millions. Maybe I can do the same.”Patrick

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  40. Hi Entertained:

    Yep, the BlackBox analysis is great and I worship at the altar thereof. LOL

    But, the blackbox application is only applicable (it seems to me) when analyzing funds in and funds out relationships, not compensation plans.

    Any compensation plan, even single tier comp plans, would fail blackbox test because of the “infinity” factor.

    That’s why a valuable product or service that’s being sold is so darn important.

    If the product or service has value all of it’s own accord then it can make sense. In other words, yes, it’s impossible for everyone to make money because you eventually run out of warm bodies.

    But, if the product has value, then, those that don’t make money with the referral compensation system are happy because they have the product (or service, etc.)

    This is the one aspect where MOST network marketing companies fail. They live on the fact that people either don’t care about the product or they sell the more expensive soap, etc. based on “yes, it might be expensive compared to what you get in the grocery store, but, you only need to fine two people……”

    That, right there, is the Achilles heel of most MLM’s.

    But, if the product/service can honestly, truly, completely stand on it’s own with the referral compensation plan being ancillary, then you have a solid situation.

    At least that’s the way I see it. :)

    ARWR

    Entertained: ARWR,I know previously you have read and understood the Black Box analysis on ASD. If you apply the same tool to this (or other 2×2′s) you will see that they can easily be shown to be mathematically unsustainable. In the simplest case, subtract out all of the breakeven stuff(the groceries), which every pyramid scheme tries to introduce in order to convolute the facts.Fortunately, the BBM gets rid of the convolutions.What is left after taking the groceries off of the table is a simple pyramid scheme where the earlier “investors” make money from the later “investors” and the odds of the later investors breaking even are far poorer than for the early entrants.Further, in reasonably short order, like all pyramids, eventually EVERYONE on the planet needs to sign up in order for the scheme to run its maximum course, which is less than 13 full cycles(6 to the thirteenth power).Illegal I am afraid……..

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  41. ARWR,

    You are correct in your assertion that a viable (and legal) business needs a solid product that can stand on its own. The problem with MPB is that they do not really have a standalone product. The reality is that they have tried to bundle a garden variety pyramid with a potentially viable business (online ordering and delivery of groceries). Unfortunately the bundling of the pyramid with the groceries does not make the combination legal. As an extreme analogy, what if, with your bag of groceries, MPB sent you a certificate that was a get-out-of-jail-free card for you that would enable you to kill the person of your choice and then get off scot-free. Absurd example, I admit, but it illustrates that you cannot bundle something illegal with something legal and make the sum of the two legal. Same thing here, and THAT’S the Black Box analysis. Subtract off the grocery piece, assuming it is effectively a break-even proposition, and you are left with a simple pyramid where the later entrants give their money to the early ones. The math is very simple — only 14% of the people will make money (mathematically, the equivalent “first” person in each matrix) and six (the later entrants in the matrix) will lose money.

    arandomwalkrant: …..snip…..

    ….if the product/service can honestly, truly, completely stand on it’s own with the referral compensation plan being ancillary, then you have a solid situation.At least that’s the way I see it. ARWR

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  42. Added to which, there needs to be a visible mechanism in place which prevents people making money solely from recruiting or even making the bulk of their money from recruiting.

    Law enforcement will look suspiciously at companies which try to use the strategy of “we have product/s which make us legal (nudge, nudge, wink, wink) but the REAL money is to be made in recruiting”

    IOW, merely providing the “opportunity” to make money from product sales does not cancel out the fact it is possible to make most of the income based solely on recruiting.

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  43. Entertained:

    Yep, agreed.

    Guess I should have clarified that my comments were related to discussion of the generic black box as applied too mlm compensation plans in general and 2×2’s in particular, not to MBP.

    I wouldn’t touch that program/product with a ten foot pole. (or, as the narrator in “The Grinch” would say, “a 39 and a half foot pole” LOL)

    Gots to be a product that stands on it’s own without the biz op, no doubt.

    ARWR

    Entertained: ARWR,You are correct in your assertion that a viable (and legal) business needs a solid product that can stand on its own.The problem with MPB is that they do not really have a standalone product.The reality is that they have tried to bundle a garden variety pyramid with a potentially viable business (online ordering and delivery of groceries). Unfortunately the bundling of the pyramid with the groceries does not make the combination legal.As an extreme analogy, what if, with your bag of groceries, MPB sent you a certificate that was a get-out-of-jail-free card for you that would enable you to kill the person of your choice and then get off scot-free.Absurd example, I admit, but it illustrates that you cannot bundle something illegal with something legal and make the sum of the two legal.Same thing here, and THAT’S the Black Box analysis.Subtract off the grocery piece, assuming it is effectively a break-even proposition, and you are left with a simple pyramid where the later entrants give their money to the early ones.The math is very simple — only 14% of the people will make money (mathematically, the equivalent “first” person in each matrix) and six (the later entrants in the matrix) will lose money.

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  44. Glenn clearly needs some kind of professional mental health intervention. (But if history is any gauge, he won’t get it.)
    Or perhaps you could send Maddy the Wonder Puppy to bite him.

    His drivel is so unintelligent (simply recycled ASD justifications) I’m almost embarrassed for him. But not quite. I think a good dog bite might help me overcome the revulsion I felt reading his nonsense.

    If you don’t want to send Maddy alone, perhaps Chili Dog would accompany her. Chili Dog could get him on the ankle, at least.

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