Zeek Fallout Almost Too Strange To Contemplate

For starters, Zeek affiliates being approached by upline sponsors and email/website appeals to send in money “to defend Zeek Rewards and all of our independent businesses as per our legal rights of due process” might want to read this July 25 PP Blog post.

It’s about how wordplay was used to sanitize HYIP scams.

For additional background, Zeek affiliates might want to read this July 28 PP Blog post.

It’s about how purported Zeek “consultant” Robert Craddock sought to disable the Hub of Zeek critic “K. Chang.” Craddock now is part of the effort to raise funds to “defend” Zeek affiliates.

Zeek and untold thousands of its minions are known to have a tin ear for PR. That tin ear is on full display again today, with a “warning” from the leaders of the effort to “defend” Zeek from the SEC’s Aug. 17 allegations that it was a $600 million Ponzi and pyramid scheme not to contact the SNR Denton law firm.

“We have asked the firm to provide us the names of the individuals that are calling; we will refund your donation and will remove you from the group to be represented if you call. The law firm is only going to discuss the case with the 12 leaders and we will put out the information to the entire group on this site.”

“This site,” as it were, is this site, which calls itself ZTeamBiz.

ZTeamBiz, which calls itself a “professional organization,” says its has hired SNR Denton. The precise reason why is unclear, although ZTeamBiz says the “SEC has tried to make us all believe that Zeek Rewards was an ‘investment’ and a Ponzi scheme. All the pages that were submitted by the SEC indictment has all been one sided and what we believe to be a misrepresentation of the truth and facts of what Zeek Rewards was as a viable and legal business.”

And ZTeamBiz also accused the SEC of misleading a federal judge.

One of the persons on the ZTeamBiz squad — although it’s unclear if his presence is formal or informal — is Todd Disner. Disner is a former pitchman for the AdSurfDaily Ponzi scheme and, along with former attorney Dwight Owen Schweitzer, sued the government in November 2011. Disner and Schweitzer alleged that prosecutors and a U.S. Secret Service agent presented a “tissue of lies” to a federal judge when bringing the civil portion of the ASD Ponzi case in August 2008.

Disner and Schweitzer made that claim after ASD had lost the case in U.S. District Court and the U.S. Court of Appeals. Among other things, Disner and Schweitzer claimed the government had gone shopping for a friendly judge when it brought the forfeiture proceedings.

That judge allegedly was targeted with a false lien by Kenneth Wayne Leaming, who also targeted three federal prosecutors and a Secret Service agent with false liens, according to the FBI. Leaming was arrested by an FBI Terrorism Task Force in November 2011. He is a purported “sovereign citizen.” All five of the federal officials targeted in the alleged lien campaign have ties to the ASD case.

ASD President Andy Bowdoin pleaded guilty seven months later to a Ponzi-related charge of wire fraud. He is scheduled to be sentenced Wednesday.

Zeek is known to have members in common with ASD, which federal prosecutors have described as a $119 million Ponzi scheme that created at least 9,000 victims before its 2008 collapse amid allegations by the U.S. Secret Service of Ponzi fraud.

Like Zeek, ASD claimed it was not offering an investment program. And like Zeek, ASD planted the seed it offered a daily payout rate of 1 percent a day or more.

Like Zeek, ASD came under investigation by the U.S. Secret Service. The agency has referred to ASD as a “criminal enterprise,” with the U.S. Department of Justice calling ASD “insidious.”

Those descriptions apparently were not enough to dissuade investors from throwing money at Zeek, which has listed ASD members as “employees.”

On Aug, 4, Zeek itself blasted unspecified “North Carolina Credit Unions” for raising concerns about Zeek. Zeek warned members to toe the company line.

The SEC was in federal court 13 days later.

Zeek also is known to have members in common with JSS Tripler/JustBeenPaid, which appears now to have morphed into something called “ProfitClicking.” Both JSS/JBP and ProfitClicking may have ties to the sovereign-citizens movement.

A domain registered in the name of purported JSS/JBP operator Frederick Mann once linked to videos featuring Francis Schaeffer Cox, a purported sovereign citizen implicated in a murder plot against public officials in Alaska.

Because HYIP scams typically are promoted on Ponzi-scheme forums such as TalkGold and MoneyMakerGroup — and because Zeek, JSS/JBP, ProfitClicking and ASD all had a presence on those forums — questions have been raised about whether cash was circulating between and among various fraud schemes and placing U.S. banks in the position of possessing fraudulent proceeds.

A receiver has been appointed to marshal the assets of the alleged Zeek fraud.

Despite the appeal by ZTeamBiz for Zeek affiliates to send in money to “defend” themselves and the company, the interests of all Zeek affiliates almost certainly are not equivalent.  Net “winners” almost certainly are at risk of clawback lawsuits from the receiver. Such court actions are used to enlarge the pool through which victims of a Ponzi fraud receive a disbursement designed to make them as whole as possible.

It’s often the case that victims never are made whole and receive disbursements of dimes or even pennies on the dollar. Such is the case to date for victims of the 2009 Trevor Cook Ponzi caper in Minnesota. That scheme was a form of affinity fraud targeted largely at people of faith, including senior citizens.

Post-Ponzi receiverships sometimes turn into an international paper chase because scammers hide money offshore.  Reverse-engineering a Ponzi caper can take years. Even as Zeek receiver Kenneth D. Bell begins his duties, scammers on the Ponzi boards are planting the seed that the receivership cannot be trusted.

In the 2009 Mantria/Speed of Wealth Ponzi scheme case, which in part was pushed MLM-style, a federal judge issued a specific order not to interfere with the receiver.

 

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47 Responses to “Zeek Fallout Almost Too Strange To Contemplate”

  1. Quick note to “Beth.”

    ZERO chance I’m going to publish your spam.

    Patrick

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  2. Just as a side note, the Wikipedia pages for “High-yield investment program” and “List of Ponzi schemes” have been recently updated. They both now contain references to Zeek Rewards.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-yield_investment_program
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ponzi_schemes

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  3. In conference call, receiver tells reporters there may be 2 million victims.

    See Forbes’ article:

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/jordanmaglich/2012/08/27/zeek-receiver-holds-press-conference-with-media-up-to-two-million-victims-herculean-effort-ahead/

    Patrick

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  4. Tony H: Just as a side note, the Wikipedia pages for “High-yield investment program” and “List of Ponzi schemes” have been recently updated. They both now contain references to Zeek Rewards.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-yield_investment_program
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ponzi_schemes

    Thanks for these, Tony.

    Patrick

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  5. So am I understanding this correctly? The lawsuit against the SEC on behalf of Zeek affiliates is only going to be the top 12 earners? The way the ex-Zeeks around here are talking, there is a huge class action suit on behalf of all Zeekers to shut down the SEC’s receivership/investigation and to bring Zeek back to life.

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  6. Joe Mama: So am I understanding this correctly?The lawsuit against the SEC on behalf of Zeek affiliates is only going to be the top 12 earners?The way the ex-Zeeks around here are talking, there is a huge class action suit on behalf of all Zeekers to shut down the SEC’s receivership/investigation and to bring Zeek back to life.

    What they *say* and what actually happens are often quite divergent. that’s how a Ponzi operates from the very beginning.

    I don’t know about the top 12 suing SEC. I didn’t receive word who’s behind the lawsuit other than Disner, Craddock, and Kettner. I need to compare the list of “supporters” vs. the top earners. I’m sure there are a lot of “silent partners” not on the list.

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  7. Looks like Disner,Craddock and Kettner must have taken lessons from Robert G and his slick partner Larry F and then again they may be behind this as well since I heard that Robert G had over 75 people in his downline with Zeek.

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  8. OK, I misunderstood the information above until I read the website. Apparently the law firm is going to discuss proceedings only with the 12 people at the head of the group, and they in turn will disseminate whatever information they deem necessary to the rest.

    I did have to chuckle at “WE ARE WORKING NOW TO GET ZEEK REWARDS AND ZEEKLER BACK OPEN!” Yeah, good luck with that. I’ll bet you one million Zeek VIP points that it doesn’t happen.

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  9. Quick note: A reader has informed us that an email circulating within a Zeek group with apparent ties to the Zeek funraising group tells recipients that the receiver’s news conference today did “did not last that long and not that much new info was released.”

    You’ll note above that Forbes magazine is reporting that the receiver said there may be 2 million victims, which is basically double the earlier estimate by the SEC:

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/jordanmaglich/2012/08/27/zeek-receiver-holds-press-conference-with-media-up-to-two-million-victims-herculean-effort-ahead/

    That email is the same kinds of nonsense that happened during the ASD case. So, Zeekers might be well advised to look for signs of news being minimized.

    A longtime PP Blog reader once pointed out that, if a Ponzi schemer suffered a severed arm during battle, it would be described as merely a flesh wound.

    Patrick

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  10. Talk about tilting at windmills.

    Don Quixote had nothing on this bunch.

    Our goals are simple, first protect everyone one of us by first proving that Zeek was not a ponzi scheme, second by assisting Paul Burke to re-open Zeek Rewards allowing all of us to continue making money. And last to prevent the government from keeping all the money that we used to purchase bids with and the money we have received or is pending in one of the e-wallets.

    We feel our chances are good and expect to restore Zeek to a position better than it was before

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  11. If I live to be 100 I will always remember Patrick’s description of the Steroidal Puppeteers.

    Think about it.

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  12. LORM wrote: “If I live to be 100 I will always remember Patrick’s description of the Steroidal Puppeteers.”

    I replied: I hope you do live to be 100, LORM. You are one of the people who’ve made all of this worthwhile.

    Patrick

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  13. What bother’s me is that people still do not understand how these criminal schemes work. You have explained it until you are blue in the face, as have many more. It is common sense, but still they continue to give credbility to the Troy Dooley’s and other greedy idiots of this world, instead of facing the reality of what they are doing by joining these schemes. They are frauds. They are set up to be frauds. They have a group of greedy followers who will promote the next best fraudulent way of separating decent people from their hard earned money and they still carry on inventing new schemes to do the same when they catch them out with the old ones

    Isn’t it time that people woke up to the fact that the criminals have moved to the internet and are taking people for all they have because it is easier and more profitable than the crimes of old.

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  14. Isn’t it time that people woke up to the fact that the criminals have moved to the internet

    For most “normal” non HYIP ponzi playing people, what’s happened/happening is, as Patrick puts it just plain “bizarre”

    In fact, I’d venture a guess that many/most of them had never even heard the word “ponzi” prior to the past few weeks and, even now, most of them have no idea what it involves.

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  15. I can’t believe the people who got me in ZR are asking for my information so they can use me on their list, and asking me for a donation to their legal defense???? Wow, they must think a sucker is born every minute!!!! Richard Marks you are trying real hard to get ZR back. Why???

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  16. Greg C: Wow, they must think a sucker is born every minute!!!!

    Got it in one.

    It’s all in the numbers.

    If “only” 10% of the supposed million members fall for it, that’s still 100,000 people and now the receiver is guesstimating there were more than a million.

    In fact, I take it a step further.

    The only people being none judgmental here are the fraudsters.

    They don’t use words like “stupid” and “deserving” and “serves the greedy ba*****s right” which only serve to alienate the 100,000 even further.

    They’re in it solely for the money and leave the recriminations to others.

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  17. Yeah, this is from the guy, who was both acting as “consultant” to RVG, and selling “leads” to Zeek affiliates at the SAME TIME.

    Shaking the money tree at both ends must be fun.

    http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com/2012/08/can-you-have-scam-feed-off-another-scam.html

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  18. SNR DENTON is unbelievable huge and powerful. I don’t know if anyone has done their research on this firm, but the SEC will have their hands full. Hope they knew what they were doing. I was reading about how they shut ZR down and seems like they jumped the gun to get credit for a big hit. What really sucks is that our tax dollars will be wasting away on this for a long time. The United states tax dollars will spend millions if not hundreds of millions of dollars defending the SEC. AS far as I can tell the SEC didn’t investigate, but scared Paul Burks into handing the company over by telling him he would spend the rest of his life in jail if he didn’t turn it over immediately. Regardless of how people feel about this company, I worry about our country. I am scared to start a business or do anything in this country anymore. The IRS, SEC, FBI, FTC, secret service and many other agencies are playing big brother. Yeah it’s easy to say if you do business right, pay your taxes and stay on the straight and narrow, nothing will happen. The USA is Trillions in debt by the same people shutting down companies. Social Security is the biggest Ponzi structure in the world. It just takes a few people in the right position, whether jealous or a competing company to make a few calls to screw it all up. I feel sorry for zeek affiliates. By time the government gets there hands on the big pie, zeek affiliates will be left will little.

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  19. Joe,

    At last glance, the Zeek people do not have the $200K they need to retain SNR Denton. In their wide eyed world, they will easily get over 2 million from Zeek members, maybe even 20 Million eventually. The same thoughts that Andy Bowdoin had when he began spouting the wonders of OneX.

    If these people actually do get the retainer money together, there is no guarantee that they can continue without a huge influx of money to their “war chest”. If the Diamond affiliates, like Todd Disner, were really pulling in one Million dollars a month, let them foot the bill!

    Put up or shut up, I say!!!

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  20. Joe: AS far as I can tell the SEC didn’t investigate, but scared Paul Burks into handing the company over by telling him he would spend the rest of his life in jail if he didn’t turn it over immediately.

    Joe,

    Please explain how — “AS far as [you] can tell” — the SEC didn’t investigate.

    The reason I ask is because some of the ASDers claimed in 2008 that the Secret Service didn’t investigate. Over the next few months, it became quite evident that the Secret Service did lots and lots of investigating.

    The ASDers who earlier claimed the Secret Service didn’t investigate later ended up looking pretty silly.

    Joe: The USA is Trillions in debt by the same people shutting down companies. Social Security is the biggest Ponzi structure in the world. It just takes a few people in the right position, whether jealous or a competing company to make a few calls to screw it all up.

    These are deflections used in more Ponzi schemes than I can count. The ASDers used them.

    Joe: By time the government gets there hands on the big pie, zeek affiliates will be left will little.

    That’s pretty much what the scammers on MoneyMakerGroup are saying.

    Patrick

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  21. Joe,

    Oh, and the problem with this country is people who think they can start a “business” that isn’t a business, but a pyramid scheme. There is a huge difference.

    And, BTW, the “social security is a ponzi” argument is so stupid to begin with. I wish the serial promoters would give that a rest. Find something else to liken to a Ponzi, like Zeek Rewards and ASD!!

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  22. Joe: AS far as I can tell the SEC didn’t investigate,

    Goodness, how interesting.

    Tell me, which SEC investigator gave you the information, or did you get it direct from Paul Burks ??

    If what you say is true, I wonder how the S.E.C. managed to obtain all the details of Zeeks’ operation included in the complaint they presented to the court.

    You have read the complaint right through, I take it ?

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  23. admin:
    Joe,Please explain how — “AS far as [you] can tell” — the SEC didn’t investigate.The reason I ask is because some of the ASDers claimed in 2008 that the Secret Service didn’t investigate. Over the next few months, it became quite evident that the Secret Service did lots and lots of investigating.
    The ASDers who earlier claimed the Secret Service didn’t investigate later ended up looking pretty silly.These are deflections used in more Ponzi schemes than I can count. The ASDers used them.
    That’s pretty much what the scammers on MoneyMakerGroup are saying.Patrick

    Patrick, I am totally biased. I don’t know anything about ASD. I know that if a man kills a man with a gun and defends himself in this country and is convicted and sentenced to death, then a person still has the right to defend his rights even if the charge has to do with killing a man with a gun. It’s looks and smell the same theory. The problem with this country and human beings in general are quick to believe propaganda such as yourself over their own abilities to develop and think for themselves. You would like everyone to believe that your are right about everything you say or do. It’s quite the power trip I can tell. I am sure you smile and puff on a large cigar and pretend your the internet Rush Limbaugh of know all.

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  24. littleroundman:
    Goodness, how interesting.Tell me, which SEC investigator gave you the information, or did you get it direct from Paul Burks ??If what you say is true, I wonder how the S.E.C. managed to obtain all the details of Zeeks’ operation included in the complaint they presented to the court.You have read the complaint right through, I take it ?

    I developed my own opinion, which has become somewhat of a lost art in the USA. I am proud in the fact that I don’t believe everything the news or our government likes us to believe. It is actually a freedom I take pretty seriously. It’s a huge game for us all. Most of the internet is companies trying to tear down other companies with the threat of competition.

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  25. Wizzard7: Joe,Oh, and the problem with this country is people who think they can start a “business” that isn’t a business, but a pyramid scheme. There is a huge difference.
    And, BTW, the “social security is a ponzi” argument is so stupid to begin with. I wish the serial promoters would give that a rest. Find something else to liken to a Ponzi, like Zeek Rewards and ASD!!

    What business are you in?

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  26. admin: Quick note: A reader has informed us that an email circulating within a Zeek group with apparent ties to the Zeek funraising group tells recipients that the receiver’s news conference today did “did not last that long and not that much new info was released.”You’ll note above that Forbes magazine is reporting that the receiver said there may be 2 million victims, which is basically double the earlier estimate by the SEC:http://www.forbes.com/sites/jordanmaglich/2012/08/27/zeek-receiver-holds-press-conference-with-media-up-to-two-million-victims-herculean-effort-ahead/That email is the same kinds of nonsense that happened during the ASD case. So, Zeekers might be well advised to look for signs of news being minimized.A longtime PP Blog reader once pointed out that, if a Ponzi schemer suffered a severed arm during battle, it would be described as merely a flesh wound.Patrick

    Where they all paying affiliates? Do you know this info? Do you know how many of those made money? Do you know how many actually put more than 20 dollars in? Do you know anything that is relevant?

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  27. littleroundman: it ?

    I know about as much as Patrick, you and everyone else on the internet about this case, which is basically nothing. Let’s all shake hands and admit the truth. We know nothing about anything, but can only express our own opinions. I don’t care if Paul or zeek burns in the depths of Hates, but I do care about our country and the direction it’s going. Paul and Zeek Rewards better make a lot of room, because it’s headed in the same place. Pack your bags and learn Chinese, and maybe you’ll have a chance. Why your at it, vote for higher taxes, and the rest of your freedoms away.

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  28. Joe: SNR DENTON is unbelievable huge and powerful.I don’t know if anyone has done their research on this firm, but the SEC will have their hands full.

    That’s what Zeekheads said before… Zeek hired Grimes AND Nehra AND Laggos (and who else?). They can’t POSSIBLY be non-compliant.

    This argument just doesn’t fly. This is “association with authority” fallacy.

    Hope they knew what they were doing.I was reading about how they shut ZR down and seems like they jumped the gun to get credit for a big hit.What really sucks is that our tax dollars will be wasting away on this for a long time.The United states tax dollars will spend millions if not hundreds of millions of dollars defending the SEC.

    You are welcome to your opinion, but it is based on facts? Or one-side narrative you get from the perpetrators of propaganda? Did you know Hitler accused Roosevelt and Churchil of “warmongering” before WW2 started? Beautiful propaganda.

    AS far as I can tell the SEC didn’t investigate, but scared Paul Burks into handing the company over by telling him he would spend the rest of his life in jail if he didn’t turn it over immediately.

    And how did you think the details in the SEC complaint surfaced? Did they just magically appeared out of thin air? You probably do as it fits with your narrative: SEC just made up the sh__ to close Zeek. But that just proves you didn’t read the complaint itself before making up your mind.

    Regardless of how people feel about this company, I worry about our country.I am scared to start a business or do anything in this country anymore.The IRS, SEC, FBI, FTC, secret service and many other agencies are playing big brother.

    Bullsh__. “Andy’s Fundraising army” for ASD scam tried that argument back around 2008 when ASD got shut. And the same argument was used in various Ponzis around the world. You have NO statistics to prove your point. YOU are the one “fear-mongering”.

    Social Security is the biggest Ponzi structure in the world.

    The guy who literally wrote the book on Charles Ponzi disagrees. Go look up the Forbes article.

    It just takes a few people in the right position, whether jealous or a competing company to make a few calls to screw it all up.

    Oh, sure, blame a “conspiracy” now. Blame capitalism. Blame everything and everybody except address the issue: Zeek got hit because it looks like a Ponzi scheme, and the owner when confronted with the evidence, plead “no contest” and choose NOT to have a trial, just gave up.

    I feel sorry for zeek affiliates.By time the government gets there hands on the big pie, zeek affiliates will be left will little.

    I feel sorrier for Zeek affiliates who must justify their own foolishness by lashing out at everything except their own mistake and what they mistakenly believed in.

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  29. Hey,

    K Chang, What do you do for a living?

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  30. Hey, K Chang, I may just start my own website and call your website a scam and make money off of the traffic it generates with your defenders. It’s a game right?

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  31. K Chang, you are a ponzi scheme.

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  32. And for you Patrick Pretty. Thanks for the idea. I have been looking for a couple sites to profit off of.

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  33. Joe:
    The problem with this country and human beings in general are quick tobelieve propaganda such as yourself over their own abilities to develop and think for themselves.You would like everyone to believe that your are right about everything you say or do.It’s quite the power trip I can tell.I am sure you smile and puff on a large cigar and pretend your the internet Rush Limbaugh of know all.

    And the same doesn’t apply to you? Sheesh. Go look in a mirror. YOU believe you’re right regarding zeek, the country, social security, and blah blah blah.

    The difference is we can back up our observations by law, past cases, logic, and evidence.

    Can you?

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  34. K. Chang:
    And the same doesn’t apply to you? Sheesh. Go look in a mirror. YOU believe you’re right regarding zeek, the country, social security, and blah blah blah.
    The difference is we can back up our observations by law, past cases, logic, and evidence.
    Can you?

    Did you change your first name from an Asian name? Since I don’t know you personally, then I can come to the conclusion that you moved to the United States, possibly illegally and changed your first name. I know someone that did this, so I can only assume since this has happened in the past and that most Asians may have entered the US illegally. So therefore I have the right to call the US immigration services and tell them I have a border jumper. Your argument would justify my action.

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  35. K. Chang:
    And the same doesn’t apply to you? Sheesh. Go look in a mirror. YOU believe you’re right regarding zeek, the country, social security, and blah blah blah.
    The difference is we can back up our observations by law, past cases, logic, and evidence.
    Can you?

    Oh, you must be in law. Well, I’m not a lawyer, attorney, judge, or prosecutor so you must be right! No contest.

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  36. Joe: Hey,K Chang, I may just start my own website and call your website a scam and make money off of the traffic it generates with your defenders.It’s a game right?
    […..]
    K Chang, you are a ponzi scheme.
    […..]
    Did you change your first name from an Asian name?

    The “A MLM Skeptic” blog has a series of articles titled “Bad Argument”. I suspect that “Joe” is providing ample examples of previous “Bad Arguments”, or material for new articles.

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  37. Joe:
    Did you change your first name from an Asian name? Since I don’t know you personally, then I can come to the conclusion that you moved to the United States, possibly illegally and changed your first name.I know someone that did this, so I can only assume since this has happened in the past and that most Asians may have entered the US illegally.So therefore I have the right to call the US immigration services and tell them I have a border jumper. Your argument would justify my action.

    Claiming that “most” Asians may have entered illegally is a gross misunderstanding of history, Joe. Asia is not one country, and there have been Asian communities well-established throughout the United States for something in the range of 125-150 years, if not longer. Were there not Chinese settlements up and down the Pacific coast during California’s Gold Rush period?

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  38. Chang,

    But were not stating facts, were stating hypothetical reasoning here. Let’s assume Zeek is a ponzi because ASD was a Ponzi. Well the next time the government wants to shut down a company, you can say, well they shut down Zeek and that was a ponzi. Then if anyone brings anything up that doesn’t agree with you, your redundant argument will be, that’s just what the zeeklers would comment on. You are most likely a huge dork with limited cash on hand, living in a trashy one bedroom apartment while tabbing back and forth between porn and blogs. Tony H is your IM buddy and a big part of the circle jerk you call Patrick P. Why would anyone visit a site called bad argument. You must have visited the site for cheesy bad jokes for guys that can’t meet real girls. You guys will never have money, will never have nice things besides the computer you put together that is worth more than your 82 honda accord. Lucky for me, that when I stop commenting on this, I can walk around in my huge ass house turn on all the lights, air down to 60 decide on which one of my six flat screen tv’s hanging all over my walls to watch then order in some really expensive food and pound my beautiful wife later. Why??? because I can!!!! Why, because I have been involved in a lot of so called “ponsi’s” that have given me the American dream baby!!!! So while you stare out of your 1 bedroom apartment and take a glimpse at what you can’t have. Think about me and how much you wish you were raised a little more smarter in life and wish that you could afford the five hundred a month to fund your own website, which is my electric bill every month. So keep up the investigations and know that your really not making a difference. I repeat your not making a difference. ProfHenryHiggins I don’t really don’t care about history. I took it in college, but it was in between frat parties and real subjects such as math.

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  39. Wizzard7: Joe,At last glance, the Zeek people do not have the $200K they need to retain SNR Denton. In their wide eyed world, they will easily get over 2 million from Zeek members, maybe even 20 Million eventually. The same thoughts that Andy Bowdoin had when he began spouting the wonders of OneX.If these people actually do get the retainer money together, there is no guarantee that they can continue without a huge influx of money to their “war chest”. If the Diamond affiliates, like Todd Disner, were really pulling in one Million dollars a month, let them foot the bill!
    Put up or shut up, I say!!!

    They have over 1 million dollars now. Thanks.

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  40. Quick note: “Joe” is done now. He apparently thought it prudent to create an Asian surname and fire up a page on Hubpages to attack K. Chang and me.

    “lol,” he says.

    Patrick

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  41. What seems likely with the top 12 hiring a high priced lawyer is they (the net winners) are going to use that legal talent to prevent clawbacks from them (those twelve). Any clawbacks would, based upon some recent cases, eventually be used to return lost funds to the affiliates who were net losers int eh scam.

    Now think a minute. The big winners want you to pay their legal bills so that they can avoid paying you back some of the money they got that was stolen from you.

    As far as suing to keep Zeek open, not gonna happen, part of the court order that shut Zeek down is an anti-injunction clause that prevents legal cases from outsiders to overturn the action.

    Also important to note is that the fundraisers don’t want you to call the lawyers. Wonder why? I’ll tell you, it’s because those lawyers represent them, (the twelve) and NOT anyone else. I call on these fundraisers to publish the engagement agreement with the law firm to show just exactly who is being represented.

    (and on another note, since they are requesting donations be sent directly to them, not only can you not write it off as a business expense, but they, whether they know it or not, will have to claim it as income and pay taxes on it, and when I get a definitive list of who they are, I’m so going to tell the IRS on them.)

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  42. Quick note: Now there’s a “Joe2” trying to post — two in rapid succession.

    Ain’t gonna happen.

    Patrick

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  43. Make that three [Now FIVE] in rapid succession.

    Patrick

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  44. admin: Quick note: “Joe” is done now. He apparently thought it prudent to create an Asian surname and fire up a page on Hubpages to attack K. Chang and me.“lol,” he says.
    Patrick

    Hubpages don’t approve bullsh__ hubs. It’s “substandard” and “personal attack”. If he actually posts one, feel free to “flag” him. :)

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  45. Just addressing Joe’s lame ad hominem attacks…

    Joe:
    Did you change your first name from an Asian name? …

    What’s it to you? :) Feel free to “imagine” sh__ though. I’m sure you feel better doing it. Though I can figure why you’d sink that low into the cesspool…

    Joe:
    Oh, you must be in law. Well, I’m not a lawyer, attorney, judge, or prosecutor so you must be right! No contest.

    So you’re not going to defend your position? Is that a surrender?

    Joe: Chang,But were not stating facts, were stating hypothetical reasoning here.

    Wow, you must have calmed down, or you’re like “Sven” on my hub, posting from two separate addresses with two separate personalities. :D

    Let’s assume Zeek is a ponzi because ASD was a Ponzi.

    Zeek is a Ponzi because Paul Burks accepted the final judgement, accepting the facts presented in the complaint without appeal.

    Which of course, renders the rest of your infantile attempts at logic and insults moot.

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  46. Sheesh, I miss all the fun. Joe made me think of “little joe” from days ago.

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  47. Didn’t Don over at ASDupdates posted a video from a Joe something showing Todd Disner in some Portuguese Zeek promo? Betcha it’s the same Joe.

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